In case you haven’t noticed, our government has a little problem. You see, over the past few years they’ve been printing dollar bills faster than Heinz makes ketchup, and despite what we’re all lead to believe, this process has only one ending—Inflation. That’s right, prices will go way up because the value of a dollar bill will go way down, all because there are too many of the dang things floating around out there.
I tell you this my friends because there is another inflation alive and well in our midst, and it’s that of blog comments, and the culprit is an upstart organization called Livefyre.
Now before Gini Dietrich sends the Chicago mafia after me for making this claim, let me simply say here that I’m not anti Livefyre. Nope, not at all. I’m just making some observations with this post, and I hope you’ll hang around until the end to give yours as well….
Michael Schechter and ‘The Gini Comment Experiment’
This article comes off the heels of one of the funniest social/blog commenting experiments I’ve ever been a part of. To give you the background, a few weeks ago I was joking with my friend Michael Schechter about Gini Dietrich and her propensity to be queen (well deserved btw) of all things commenting and community over there on her blog Spin Sucks. So, being the outrageous nut-cake he is, Schechter devised a plan to guest post on Gini’s site and sarcastically call all hands on deck to help him, at least for a day, get more comments than Gini Dietrich on her very blog. It was an epically silly, stupid, and fun idea and after whipping up the article in about 25 minutes, Schechter shot it over to me in an email and immediately I knew it would be a commenting hit. Even crazier, Gini was kind enough to run the post. Yep, the gal knows how to have a laugh.
So earlier today, at 1pm eastern standard time (oops, I’m writing this post at 1:30am, so it’s actually yesterday 
), Michael’s guest post went live. Quickly I jumped on and started spouting off comments that basically made no sense, nor had any value as a whole, but the point of this little experiment was not so much of deep conversation—it was an online community sharing a laugh. Quickly, Livefyre started working its magic. Schechter was replying to comments as soon as they would come in. I was doing the same. One second I’d see Livefyre telling me there were two comments on the top of the page. The next second I’d see there were 3 more comments on the bottom of the screen. ‘Likes’ were being tossed around by everyone. And for the next few hours, folks just let loose, stopping in a few minutes here and there for a laugh, and watching an act that although silly, showed just how amazing Livefyre is as a comment generating machine (well over 300 total on the post), especially in the right setting.
Livefyre it Too Good
You see, I don’t even know if ‘commenting’ platform is a proper description for Livefyre. It’s more of a conversation/awareness tool that happens to be used by many bloggers in their comment section. And when one looks at all it does, with its many notifications, real time ‘new comment’ alerts, ‘likes’, etc—it’s no wonder so many bloggers have embraced this new platform.
But that’s the thing about Livefyre- It’s too good with garnering comments. So good that while a blog post that got 50 comments 2 years ago was viewed as a pretty big deal(at least by many), today such is not so much the case, hence the idea of ‘comment inflation’.
Tweet Inflation through Triberr
To me, the Triberr movement is actually no different. Think about it. It used to be a big deal to get over 25 tweets on a post for the average blogger. These days, it’s not such a big deal at all. Join a couple of tribes and ‘bang’, there are your 25 tweets.
Is that a bad thing? Yes and no. I’m a member of Triberr. I use it. I’ve seen its benefit. But it has also lead to a ‘tweet inflation’ as well. Today, because of the influence of Triberr, the value of a tweet is less than what it was a year ago.
Again, I’m not here to say Livefyre or Triberr are good or bad. They both have major benefits. But to act like they don’t have their own unique drawbacks is simply turning a blind eye in my opinion.
Why I’m a Livefyre Holdout
Many folks have asked me why I haven’t made the switch yet to Livefyre. They see I get a pretty decent amount of comments here because of the tremendous community(that’d be you 
) and for many, it’s only a natural fit for this blog.
Heck, I ask myself the same question at times, especially when some of the comment strands here on TSL get wacky as folks reply back and forth to each other. But if I was forced to give a few reasons as to why I haven’t made the switch yet, here’s what I’d say:
1. Aesthetics: Call me weird, but I’m not wild about ‘the look’ of Livefyre yet. It’s almost like they use a dull code with their design, and in my opinion, it’s just not as ‘clean’ aesthetically as the standard wordpress comment system.
2. Intimidation: Many of the folks that come here to The Sales Lion are just learning how to blog. They’ve just entered into the world of inbound marketing and are already overwhelmed. My goal is to be the one voice that actually makes complete sense to them, with clear understanding, and never speaks ‘above’ their understanding.
I say this because if you asked a new blogger to look at the comment stream of a Livefyre platform, many would feel like they were reading a different language. Seriously, I’m not kidding. I’ve actually done this experiment with my wife (who doesn’t blog at all, doesn’t know what twitter is, etc). She literally thinks reading a Livefyre comment strand is like reading Spanish—she gets about 50% of what is going on. For the folks that understand the symbols, handles, and such—there is nothing better than Livefyre. But my problem is those folks often times aren’t my paying customer.
3. 
: See those? They’re emoticons, and Livefyre doesn’t have them yet. And because I love me some emoticons, this would sure be a nice addition.
Although there are a few more minor reasons as to why I’ve held off with Livefyre, I’m also happy to admit I think the day will come when I’ll have the system here on TSL. One thing is for sure—their employees and their company are top notch. I met all of them at Blog World New York and was blown away. Every month they seem to add a great new feature to their platform, like the ability to embed video into comments or their own version of CommentLuv. And it’s for this reason that I think Livefyre actually is the future of blog commenting in general.
Your Turn:
I’ve babbled enough, now I’d like your take. What are your thoughts on comment and tweet inflation? Do you think Livefyre and Triberr have anything to do with the phenomena? Also, if you’re using Livefyre, what do you like and what do you dislike about the system? If you’re not using it, why? And finally, for those of you that are new bloggers, have you found Livefyre to be at all intimidating? Jump in folks, I expect this conversation to get pretty interesting, as everyone has an opinion….
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{ 330 comments… read them below or add one }
Personally, when it comes to a comment system on a blog, I prefer Disqus. I’ve always loved the threading and features within that particular platform. Livefyre was never my cup of tea. I remember the first time I saw it on someone’s blog and I immediately wasn’t a fan. I like entering my name, email, and website when I enter a comment. Livefyre doesn’t ask for it. I don’t know if many people like that aspect of it or not. I wonder if within the settings if you can enable it or not?
Disqus certainly has its value Frank, and in some ways, it’s a happy medium between standard WP and Livefyre. That being said, when I first started blogging and Livefyre didn’t even exist yet, I was VERY intimidated by Disqus. Having to sign up and enter info and all that stuff scared the heck out of me.
Thanks so much for starting this conversation off though bud. I expect it’s going to be a very interesting one.
Marcus
I can definitely see how Disqus can be intimidating for a beginner. There is a lot going on and you’re right, they ask for you to create an account.
Personally, Disqus was more inviting to me. I liked the look and feel of it and how the application had been designed. I was more eager to learn how to use it. Livefyre didn’t exist for quite some time and it wasn’t until recently that I learned about them.
I’m happy to contribute and get the conversation started!
Frank´s last [type] ..Has The Phrase “Thank You” Lost Value To Consumers Or Fans?
It’s not that I am scared of entering my details – it’s just so much WORK! I think my readers (present company excluded, of course
) are way too lazy to have to do that.
On a serious note, many beginners will not enter any details or sign up for “stuff” they don’t understand.
Ana @ Internet Marketing Tools´s last [type] ..Thesis Theme Giveaway: SEO in a Box?
Ana,
You remind me that my number one issue with Livefyre is that you are asked to create an account and give up your email without an opportunity to review a privacy policy or TOS first.
Tammi Kibler´s last [type] ..Facebook Fan Pages: Who Needs Them?
In fairness, Tammi, you’re not required to sign up for anything. There are various log-in options outwith the normal Livefyre account, and they’re no different from using those options elsewhere due to oAuth.
You can always check the Privacy Policy and more here:
http://www.livefyre.com/privacy/
http://www.livefyre.com/terms/
Danny Brown´s last [type] ..How to REALLY Measure the ROI of Social Media
You’re on both Facebook and Twitter, right, Tammi? You can comment through Livefyre on either of those platforms — without ever telling Livefyre who you are beyond syncing the two. No account creation necessary. Just click the Facebook etc button and approve the authorization.
Ari Herzog´s last [type] ..6 Guest Blogging Emails That Suck
It is a very bad idea to be giving all kinds of sites and entities access to our Twitter and Facebook accounts because – as I predicted when I first saw the strange wording on the oaths we are presented with – the plan is to let those sites and entities send tweets to our followers and post on our walls.
I have a screen capture I made last night where four of the first five tweets for a search for my username growmap did NOT have growmap in them, were not anything I retweeted and were from four Twitter users I was NOT following. That was a test as I haven’t see anything that isn’t mine in a search for growmap since then.
Those were really obvious to me because I regularly search for growmap to see if anyone needs me and three of them were about sports and I almost never tweet anything about sports. THAT is what is coming and I will email that screen capture to anyone who doubts my word.
It will eventually end up in a blog post – I’m just too busy with the huge April 1 Cash blogging contest launch to do additional research on that right now.
Those of us who understand the dangers of data mining and connecting everything we ever do are even more reluctant to log in using one of those than we are to share our personal information with yet another third party.
Gail Gardner´s last [type] ..Ethical Blogging: Bloggers, Is YOUR Opinion for Sale? Is Traditional Media Unbiased?
Hey Frank, Jenna from Livefyre here. We’re in the process of building a new registration process that will including guest commenting, just like what you’re asking for.
Yep, won my five bucks
(See my comment below to make sense of this random comment). P.S. You guys really need to listen to feedback more and occasionally update your product…
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..5 Lessons From My Own Stupidity
Hi Jenna,
Glad to hear that the “guest commenting” option is going to be implemented soon. Thanks for the notice.
Frank´s last [type] ..Has The Phrase “Thank You” Lost Value To Consumers Or Fans?
Yeah, I like disqus more than livefyre too. you can’t input names with space on livefyre right? And there are more blog sites that disqus is serving than the other. Disqus is really committed with Community Information and Expert Advice when it comes with their services. And the bad thing about livefyre is, you can’t edit your comments after posting and codes for hyperlink won’t work with it..
I’m not a fan of Livefrye. I know it’s growing. I see it. However, it does feel confusing. In any comment there might be five people mentioned. I’m not a fan cause I like the old way better.
I’m still using the native WP commenting system like you. To me it’s simple. It’s clean. Anyone knows how to use it. It’s got plugins I want like sending an email when I reply to their comment.
Plus I look at some of the biggest blogs I follow and they still use the WP commenting system.
I know there are fans of Livefrye and Disqus but I still like what WP has to offer. I’m sure there will be lots of discussion about this one!
Have a great day Marcus!!
Benny´s last [type] ..Life As App of the Week and How Much I Made
All very valid points Benny. Livefyre is confusing. Without question. Heck, I’ve been using it for a while now and I still scratch my head at times. Somehow they’re going to have to address this issue.
You make a very interesting point about some of the big blogs out there not using Livefyre. Why do you think that is? I think there are many A-listers that, although they appreciate comments, don’t necessarily have time for the conversation, and thus don’t want to stimulate more action in the comment stream. (Maybe one day when we’re in their shoes Benny we’ll have a better explanation, right
)
Really appreciate your support bud,
Marcus
I’m not sure why some of the big blogs use it. Maybe cause there’s not as much conversation going on so why change it.
But you have used it here and that hasn’t hindered any conversation going on. It’s a system beginners are comfortable using too.
Look forward to reading both sides of the discussion.
Benny´s last [type] ..Life As “App of the Week” and How Much I Made
I agree with you and Benny but is it really that common?
Maybe the blogs I frequent are the exception, but I rarely see LiveFyre comments.
Actually, there are quite a few Gregory, and it’s growing daily.
I see, it’s probably just where I visit that skewed my experience with those types of comments.
How are you finding Triberr these days Marcus?
I just signed up for it and I’m a bit unsure if I’m comfortable with the process, I mean, not having total control of what I’m tweeting out makes me weary of embracing the platform fully.
Have you ever fun into a situation where you regretted tweeting out a group member’s article?
How are the traffic gains that you’ve seen?
I have very mixed feelings about Triberr Gregory. It has helped me with traffic, yes, but I am also bothered my the number of tweets I put out there, so for me, it’s still up in the air my friend. Good luck!
Marcus
Personally, I’m not crazy about LiveFyre as it takes a little more time to enter a comment than other platforms. That’s why I will tend to re-tweet something by Gini rather than comment. It’s just quicker, and I’m all about efficiency with comments.
The effect of Triberr has driven me crazy. It borders on making Twitter spam central. I’ve unfollowed some members just because everybody RT the same stuff. It’s hard to keep up with if you follow bloggers in the same niche. I’d rather follow a select few (like you, Jk, Gini) as a way to keep up with some great posts that are being shared.
I don’t automate anything. All my tweets are live. If you’ve got 100 posts in my Twitter feed in an hour, I have to unfollow. I’m done.
I don’t know Marcus, maybe just the old school in me coming out. I like the KISS principle. Simple is best, especially with someone like me!!
Joe @ Not Your Average Joe´s last [type] ..You Are Like A Hurricane: No “Over Hype” Here
Joe, I really, really appreciate the frankness of your comment here.
Livefyre requires more work to get in the system. Real or apparent, that’s the ‘feel’ it puts off to visitors. And the more hoops folks have to jump through, the less likely they are to jump. Notwithstanding, the counter argument to that is once they’re actually in the system, it’s as quick as anything else and thus the benefits begin.
I completely feel what you’re saying about Triberr. I’ve had tons of invites to other tribes but have turned them all down. I automatically retweet the stuff of about 12 bloggers, and that’s a little much as it is. There are people auto-retweeting 75+ bloggers, which I feel really devalues things. It’s a tough dilemma, because you want the ‘social proof’ benefits that everyone is getting but at the same rate, you don’t want to completely devalue your stream. I struggle with this question all the time.
Not old school at all Joe. You’re just a realist bud that calls it like you see it.
Thanks so much for adding to the conversation here.
Marcus
I hear you Joe. Since I am online for work all day long I tweet quite frequently. I figure that I have lost some followers that way, but I am cool with it. I figure those who really like me will stick around as well those who are too lazy to unfollow.
But I know that none of my followers are lazy so I guess that they must really like me.,
Jack@TheJackB´s last [type] ..Write What You Know
Ha! One guy I WON’T unfollow? The JackB!! Every tweet points to quality…it’s not about the frequency, it’s about the valuuueeee. You do it, my man. Keep it up!!
Joe @ Not Your Average Joe´s last [type] ..You Are Like A Hurricane: No “Over Hype” Here
Don’t go making my head any bigger. Started a discussion on Twitter about dream cars, feel free to join in.
Jack @ TheJackB´s last [type] ..Write What You Know
We are very much alike sir, that is all.
Davina K. Brewer´s last [type] ..Angel’s in the Details
Livefyre only benefits those with hosted sites. The other thing is that if you comment on a blog that uses Livefyre, unless you have a strong personality yourself, it will seem like a party that you were not invited to.
For a while on Spin Sucks, I felt like odd man out. Obviously, I don’t feel that way anymore, but getting heard on a comment system like that can be tough at first.
As someone just starting out, comment systems such as this one can get me some page views which is always good. I do like page views!
Another really good post Marcus and you bring up a very interesting point. I am just not sold on Livefyre.
Nancy Davis´s last [type] ..Honey, I’M HOME!
You bring up a very, very valid point that goes back to my idea of ‘intimidation’ Nancy. Livefyre, because it is so good at promoting conversation, does occasionally have the feel of a bunch of folks at the dinner table sharing a laugh and conversation, at which point you have to make the decision to jump in…or not.
The question is how many folks never dive in simply because they’re intimidated by the overly social component of the Livefyre platform? I don’t know if that will ever be answered, but if these persons are potential paying customers, then ‘Houston, We Have a Problem’.
Great thoughts, as always Nancy.
Marcus
Well, I guess that would be me- I do find Livefyre intimidating. I’m not a blogger, but I’m an avid reader of blogs and I love reading the posts and comments, especially over at Spin Sucks. However I’ve never actually hopped in the conversation myself. The flip side of that is, of course, that if I were really motivated to add my two cents I would learn to use Livefyre. I’m sure it isn’t really that complicated; but the barrier to entry has thus far just been too high. Interesting post, I’m glad you’re having this conversation!
Sarah, Sarah, Sarah…I am so very glad you took a minute to say this, because there is a huge ‘voice’ out there found in folks just like you, and it needs to be heard. So the fact that you ‘hopped in the conversation’ here today is simply awesome.
One last question for you Sarah. Regarding standard WP comment platforms like this one, do you find it’s much less intimidating to jump in?
Marcus
Yes that’s kind of why I wanted to take a moment to comment, because I’m sure there are other people out there like me – people who love to read, but find the comment structure kind of intimidating. This is my favorite, the simple WP platform: it’s clean, simple and clear.
Amen to what you’re saying here Sarah. It’s amazing how many folks don’t realize just how many of your type there are out there.
Thanks again!!
Marcus
Great thread. I feel that some blogs are focused on a tight clique all vying to promote one another, and it is very intimidating. That many of them have migrated to Livefyre makes them even easier to spot and more intimidating. Posts on these blogs may be interesting, but the comments often degenerate into the same 10 or 20 people telling each other how cool they are.
Thanks for keeping it real, Marcus.
Tammi Kibler´s last [type] ..Facebook Fan Pages: Who Needs Them?
Very, very telling comment Tammi. I think there is a lot of validity in your comment here, and the thing is, if you’re feeling this, others are tool. Tell me, if you wouldn’t mind: If you used Livefyre, and built a large audience, do you think it would be possible not not put off that click-ish feel?
Thanks so much,
Marcus
Oh, now that is a great question.
I will have to think about that for a day or two.
Tammi Kibler´s last [type] ..5 Lies PLR Content Writers Want You to Believe
Hi Marcus,
I think perhaps Livefyre projects a clique to me simply because of the early adopter aspect. I have seen first one, then the next, then the next, of a group of people who all comment on one another’s blogs add Livefyre, and meanwhile many other blogs I read outside the group aren’t even paying attention yet.
As others have pointed out regarding tons of comments and cliques, you have to be clear about your target audience and how you plan to reach them.
Conversation without conversion is chatter. If it attracts those who will become customers, fine. But if you think you may be spending a lot of time talking to the wrong prospects, you may be right.
I mean, I look at this post – it sure has generated a lot of talk, but I wonder whether your ideal customer was even considering Livefyre. Maybe a bunch of skyscraper owners are hanging out in your lobby chatting about the best rooftop garden when your true customers want some help pouring concrete for their foundations.
It’s always a challenge when you reach an advanced stage to keep talking to beginners. Some bloggers find they are not able to remain as interesting to everyone.
But I know I want to watch and see how you handle it.
Tammi Kibler´s last [type] ..Should You Advertise with Groupon?
Sarah, that’s exactly how I feel when I get to a blog with Livefyre. I read Spinsucks regularly but don’t dare to comment there. It is not just that blog, but any blog with a non-native commenting systems. Disqus would be a bit better but still not even close to the native clean WP commenting system.
Just as everyone says, I feel as if I’m standing there at a party for which I’m not invited at all. Feels kinda weird and well, non-native, literally!
Thanks for bringing it up Marcus.
Jane.
Jane | Blogging Success´s last [type] ..Author Markup, Google Plus And Niche Domination In Simple Terms For Bloggers
Hi Jane, and thanks so much for adding to the conversation here with this comment. Tell me, if you were using Livefyre or Disqus or another system that’s real-time social like that, what would you do to help others feel invited? Or do you feel it’s just not possible? Do you think there should be a simpler version of LF that people could choose?
You know me and I’m not one to shy away from jumping in, but if I’m late to the party I probably won’t stop in unless someone had specifically mentioned me. Too much noise and I don’t think I would be missed or noticed either way.
Bottom line, it is keeping me away.
Bill Dorman´s last [type] ..Loud and proud, I’m coming out
You mean it’s possible to keep Bill Dorman away??
You know what’s funny Bill? And maybe I’m just naive, but it wasn’t until this comment strand that I started hearing so many people say that too many comments turns them off and thus they won’t jump in. For some reason, I hadn’t really thought about that before. Notwithstanding, you’ve done a pretty dang good job jumping in Bill.
Have a great week bud.
Marcus
I like the point you addressed there Nancy. I kind of felt out of place in the livefyre world although I went ahead and installed it on my blog anyway. I noticed a big decrease in my commenting and upon asking my readers about it, the number 1 reason was, they didn’t like that it was not easy anymore to comment. I also got complaints from mobile phone users who complained that livefyre would not play right with their mobile phones. I switched back to the native wp commenting system, slapped in commentluv and added fb commenting as well. It has been nothing short of night and day. I love my setup now. I would love to go back to livefyre but until they make it “so easy a caveman can use it” I will stick with my current setup.
~AL
My point exactly Al. Most bloggers make the huge mistake of thinking Livefyre is easy to use or not intimidating. That’s just bull. Granted, it’s all good once someone is used to it, but can be a big struggle for folks at the beginning.
BTW, are you using the ‘ReplyMe’ plugin I mentioned in this post? They baby is a must so that people read any response to their comment, similar to the email you’re getting right now.
Thanks for all your great comments Al, and for taking the time to read my blog. Hope your week is a great one and hope we chat again soon.
Marcus
Thanks for the tip on the “reply to me” plugin. I’m actually reading up on it right now. I currently use the “Thank Me Later” Plugin along with the “comment redirect” for new commentors. I like what I’m seeing with that “replyme.”
look forward to chatting again soon.
~AL
p.s. quick question. I notice you have commentluv enabled on your blog yet for some reason it wont post any of my posts. Do you have the settings off or is it only activated after a certain amount of comments. I’m not here because of that as I really just enjoy the material you have here however I am curious as to why I am the only one with no “commentluv” so to speak.
I’m not sure why c-luv does that sometimes Al. Some folks seem to have no problem with it and then others it doesn’t seem to register. Sorry, but I have no idea man.
Marcus, the issue with Livefyre for me is that sometimes I can’t see where my comment(s) show up in the stream. Sometimes the stream takes me to where I show up, sometimes not. Just seems clunky IMHO.
“Clunky” is actually a really good way to put it Bob. I agree. It’s just that, at least from a visual perspective. It’s not ‘bad’ per se, it’s just not as clean as standard WP.
Good to hear from you bud. How’s that inbound marketing coming btw??
Marcus
Making progress. Besides overseeing the new site’s and new blog’s development, I’m in the process of creating those headlines based on prospect’s questions. Thanks again for your offer to review!
Just make sure you take me up on it bud….no slackers allowed.
As a 5 month blogger who hasn’t even moved over to WP yet, I will tell you I’ve had trouble with Disqus, Livefyre, and even CommLuv and the simplistic Gravatar – none of which worked for me for one dumb reason or another at first, and took quite a bit of Time That I Don’t Have in fixing. I find the constant updates to LiveFyre annoying – my Droid is constantly blinking at me and interrupting my day until I stop to turn off updates – ugh!
What I care about are (1) actual commenters who care about what I wrote and/or are customers (2) the response I received to my post only on another blog. If I am so interested in the blog post that I want to read all of the comments, I’ll go back and do that. Otherwise all of the back and forth is a HUGE time waster – better spent on more important things.
Julie | A Clear Sign´s last [type] ..Life Purpose and The Bravery Of Just Showing Up
I’m so glad you’ve jumped in here Julie. You so very much represent exactly where I was at the beginning, and I think folks often times don’t realize just how many ‘Julies’ there are out there.
Just so you know, you can adjust all your Livefyre settings in terms of what stuff gets emailed to you. But because Livefyre hasn’t yet figured out a way to help people realize they can adjust all those things, many folks complain of exactly what you’re talking about here.
But all great points Julie and I hope you know how much I appreciate you adding to the conversation.
Marcus
I must admit the title of this post worried me a bit, but I totally get what you’re saying and I’m looking forward to seeing what people have to say. One thing we have actually struggled with internally is what to call ourselves – I feel like we are replacing the standard comment section with a real-time, social conversation. Sure, there are a ton of comments on Gini’s blog, and a lot of them are back and forth banter. The feel that I get when participating in the conversations there are more like a dinner party – people sharing their opinions, going back and forth, and uncovering the real issues at hand. Numbers may be inflated, but overall the engagement is much higher than with a standard system.
One thing that we are working on is making it more user friendly for the less tech-savvy crowd. When my friends look at my Twitter stream they have no idea what’s going on, which is what I’m guessing your wife experienced with Livefyre as well. It’s a hard balance to include the latest social paradigms that many are used to while maintaining a level of interaction that isn’t far from the norm. I appreciate this feedback and one question I ask is how do you think we can make it better? Would more education help? We’re always open to suggestions, and I hope we can continue this conversation in person again sometime soon – maybe BlogWorld LA?
(aw man, you’re right, we do need emoticons!)
Jenna Langer´s last [type] ..Recap from BlogHer11: Can’t stop blogging now!
Jenna, awesome of you to stop in so early on the conversation here and I’m going to come back to your question after some more folks have chimed in with all my thoughts. This is going to be an interesting conversation, and your participation herein is great. ttys
I’m on the fence.
Livefyre is installed on my blog (see related article linked below) but I’m beginning to get second thoughts due to various reasons, most notably because I’m seeing far more trolls adding comments and less real people. I’m also dissatisfied with what they call social synced comments (Facebook/Twitter conversations about the blog post) appearing in the wordpress database. I am very worried when/if I remove the plugin, these social comments will remain and screw up the future look of the comments.
I’m seriously toying with going with Facebook commenting. If you want to make an analogy to Heinz and money, Facebook is where things are at!
Ari Herzog´s last [type] ..Reviewing 30 Days of Livefyre Activity
Hey Ari, I’m really glad you brought up FB here, as I think it’s often ‘the forgotten commenting platform’. BTW, really like your phrase ‘social synced comments’. That’s a good way to put it.
If you wouldn’t mind telling me, and the others here too, what about FB do you feel is superior to the other platforms?
Superiority is your word, not mine.
When Mashable introduced Facebook/Twitter comments — and only Facebook/Twitter comments — I grimaced and wrote why that was a bad move: http://ariherzog.com/mashable-comment-failure
But as I subsequently thought more about their decision, it makes sense — for the same reason it may make sense on my blog or your blog. If the majority of your blog readers have Facebook accounts, it’s a no brainer to employ Facebook commenting. I don’t refer to the Disqus/Livefyre option of enabling someone to log in with Facebook, but to make it the default choice.
If a blog is focused on social media marketing, why not use a social media tool to power the commenting? I don’t know. Like I wrote above, I’m on the fence.
Ari Herzog´s last [type] ..Questioning Why I Still Use Twitter
I don’t know enough about the Facebook commenting to make an argument either way. I do have a question, and it’s this: if you use Facebook commenting, do you, the blogger, own those comments?
Erin Feldman´s last [type] ..Fierce or Christian Siriano Fierce?
No. What happens on Facebook stays on Facebook.
But, do I own this comment, or can Marcus choose to delete it?
Ari Herzog´s last [type] ..When Twitter Suspends Your Account
That’s what I thought about Facebook commenting. Hmm.
Your question is one to ponder. I suppose you lose some control when you comment on another person’s blog. That’s the way it works with a public platform.
Erin Feldman´s last [type] ..Why You Need to Have a Voice
I don’t think being on another’s site makes a big deal though in terms of a comment Erin. On all platforms you lose control there. The question is a matter of keep the comments on your site if need be…which isn’t a part of FB if I’m not mistaken.
I don’t think it’s a big deal, either. I mostly was replying to Ari’s thought.
Erin Feldman´s last [type] ..Writers Write
…just when I thought it was safe to go into the water…
I’ve been immersed in posts and comments about Livefyre, commentluv, disqus, etc. and just when I think I’m leaning in one direction, the wind whips me around to another perspective. Comment systems is one HOT topic these days.
I currently use disqus, and have been seriously considering Livefyre, but now…yikes! And that’s “yikes” in a good way. This has given me more feed for the fodder, and I’ll be chewing it around for a while longer. I look forward to watching the comments here as I consider my options. Thanks for offering another perspective. Cheers! Kaarina
Kaarina Dillabough´s last [type] ..Take Your Business Back to School
So very glad you found some food for though here Kaarina. Yes, commenting systems certainly are getting discussed a lot these days, but for good reason, as they have a big impact on a blog….or at least they can.
I can’t wait to hear further perspective myself on this subject….we’ll see where it ends up.
Thanks again,
Marcus
I lived through a really bad inflation as a kid, where we had money that was like in billions (see image http://media.cnbc.com/i/CNBC/Sections/News_And_Analysis/_News/_SLIDESHOWS/WorstInflationSituations/SS_worst_inflation_yugoslavia_currency.jpg) but you could not buy a loaf of bread with it.
So I can relate to what you are saying and it isn’t even enough to say that I agree, with both comments and tweets.
I like Livefyre but after the experiment on my blog I removed it and won’t be putting it back soon. They lack some features and the “comLuv” feature they added was only aimed at their users, which was kinda weird, cause that way they limit themselves additionally.
For what ever reason seems that these services keep “fixing” stuff that doesn’t need fixing and create something worse…
Anyway, I completely agree with you and I think Livefyre is great on Gini’s blog because people are used to it and know how to use it, but if you are targeting someone else, a newbie that has no clue about blogging, I would stick with this system.
Brankica´s last [type] ..Free Download of “99 Tasks for Blog Improvement NOW”
Great comment Bran, as always. For some reason, I didn’t know the ComLuv only applied to their peeps, but now that you mention it, I kept wondering why I’d leave a comment over at Gini’s house or another LF blog and not see my ComLuv….which sounds pretty lame to me.
And regarding newbie bloggers, I think you’re right, and we’ve really got to be careful with these folks. Just because we’re not the type to be intimidated doesn’t mean others don’t feel the same.
Thanks for the link too lady!
Marcus
Marcus,
I must say that I am not a fan of LiveFyre or Disqus. To me, it seems like more of a hassle anytime you have to log in, take additional steps, or try to figure out what all the bittons do.
I prefer just a plain old commenting system. As far as comment inflation, I don’t see that as being an issue. I think once the novelty of these fancy commenting platforms become commonplace, people will stop abusing them and we’ll see more quality and less “this is a cool button, I think i’ll click it”.
With Tribber however, I think it does have some adverse effects on the value of a tweet. I joined Triberr and have not really seen any benefit as of yet. I do know that I am auto tweeting out 10 different blogger’s posts without me having read them first though.
I’m actually getting ready to change all that becasue I don’t like it and I don’t feel good about it. I know I wouldn’t be tweeting out all of them if I had seen them first. Twitter should be a place for personal interaction, not a place to blast out 30 -50 tweets a day, half of which you don’t even know what they are.
Just keep up your good work, my friend. I know you are all about adding value.
Steve Roy´s last [type] ..Are You Living On Purpose Or Just Living?
But you don’t HAVE TO log in. Disqus has always allowed the option of typing your name and email address and web url to add a comment, a model Livefyre will soon adopt. This is on par with the vanilla system.
Ari Herzog´s last [type] ..The Battle Between Opting In and Out
Good comment, Steve. I wouldn’t want to auto tweet a post that I wouldn’t like. If I tweet a link, it’s because I find it to be a quality article. If something is a piece of crap, do you want it affiliated with your name/account?
Me no want to be affiliated with crap Joe.
Steve, good to hear from you bud, and I agree with what you’re saying about having to ‘sign in’. I know others here have said that’s not the case, but if something ‘looks’ like you have to sign in, even though you don’t, there’s less chance someone will participate.
And as far as Fiverr is concerned, it’s interesting how many folks here share your view—-this idea that diluting their stream with content they haven’t even read is possibly not a great idea.
Thanks again bud,
Marcus
I’m no expert on the various commenting systems, but I can see I’ve been blogging for over three years and I do visit many other blogs and leave comments.
That said, I cringe when I see Livefyre, Disqus, and Intense Debate and I’m far, far less likely to leave comments on blogs that use them. I know they have important features, but I prefer what I use on my blogs: standard Wordpress commenting system, enabled with Commentluv.
John Soares´s last [type] ..Write Faster: 12 Top Tips for Freelance Writers
Hey John, great to see you man. Actually, I think you speak for many folks/bloggers out there. They want simple, easy, and familiarity. Whether one likes or does not like that style, it’s the way of many, many people.
Appreciate the comment bud,
Marcus
Inflation is something that’s a bit of a problem, in my books.
Let’s think about it: people judge your blog around the content and your social perception; if they see that a blog has thousands of comments than they’re likely to assume that you’re very popular and know what you’re talking about.
The issue that rises is that the platform can be abused so mediocre information is passed off as popular, good info because of the perception that tons of people are talking about it.
Hell, you can hire people to blog comment for you and all you’d need to do is change accounts. You can inflate your comments and tweets to give a greater sense of self importance which is a little detrimental to the community at large.
Ethics.
Of course, it’s hard to prevent things like this in the first place. Look at how Mashable will get thousands of tweets but barely any comments – twitter bots. The tweets are inflated so the site gets an inflated sense of social media power.
Not sure how to approach the issue but just wanted to chime in on it.
Murray Lunn´s last [type] ..How to Make Extra Income: The Right Way
I hadn’t looked at the ‘social irresponsibility’ side of this yet Murray, but that’s a really, really interesting point man, and I’m really glad you brought it up and chimed in.
Like you, I’m not sure of the solution. Every action has its pros and cons.
Thanks for the support bud,
Marcus
I’m holding out: I want Google+ to offer a comment application for Wordpress blogs. And when they do, I predict it will be brilliant.
Dane Findley´s last [type] ..Your To-Do List: Enemy or Best Friend?
Hahaha Dane, that’s a pretty solid prediction, and I’m sure they’ve got a few million invested in that as we speak.
Don’t you think Google+ would make a comment app for Blogger 1st, seeing that it’s a Google platform to begin with?
Hey Barbara, you’d think they would, but Blogger hasn’t seemed to be a huge focus of theirs. In my opinion, Google could be doing much, much more with Blogger but they just don’t seem to give it the priority…maybe because it’s not very profitable.
Hey Marcus,
I wanted to add Livefyre to my (unused) WP website because it could save me time flipping from email to blog, etc. I loved watching conversations, but never joined in unless I wanted to reply to a reply of my own. My blogspot blog has no reply capability.
And then the school year started! I don’t know how people keep up with the comments! I do think it’s a lot of fun though. There are some days all I want to do is to read, absorb, reflect, add two cents and move on.
I think Livefyre is great for some people like me if I had no children at home and others needing me before and after school.
So, I have the plugin. I just can’t use it yet!
Hey Betsy, so great to see you here!
Yeah, that whole parenting thing can really make an impact on timing, can’t it!?
I’ll be curious to see how it goes for you though and look forward to seeing the results!
Thanks again,
Marcus
I say to those who are intimidated, SUCK IT UP. You can always find blogs that have a ton of comments and lots of banter between people. I end up in places all the time where I seem to be the odd man out and the only one who doesn’t know all of the inside jokes.
It is not LiveFyre that does it. It is commenting in general. Now there is a legitimate question about whether LiveFyre makes it “worse” or not but that is a different story.
The question I start with is why are you blogging. That is followed by what do you hope to accomplish and do you have a plan.
As the crazy old man of the blogosphere I find that lots of people can’t answer those questions so to me it doesn’t matter what commenting system they choose because they don’t even know why they are here.
Jack@TheJackB´s last [type] ..Write What You Know
Amen, Jack, amen – perfect point. None of us understand anything if we don’t take the time to look at its idiosyncrasies.
Danny Brown´s last [type] ..The Google Plus Apathy Malaise
Good one. You’re always “odd man out” at first. I’ve felt that way in a lot of spots. Eventually, the acceptance happens. I’m sure my first comments at TSL were uncomfortable for me. But, hey, look at me now….:)
Oh yeah, I think you’re younger than me too…I’m two steps from 50!!
Yep, you have a few years on me but not as many as I’d like. Going to play ball again tonight with a bunch of kids who think that Saturday Night Fever is a euphemism for getting loaded.
Jack @ TheJackB´s last [type] ..Write What You Know
Uhmm, The Jack? What got into you today? I see, count them 4 dollarific graphs you’ve written! Holy Guacamole!
Jayme Soulati´s last [type] ..Obama, Boehner and Lessons for Business
I am short on sleep, low on caffeine and generally slow today. I didn’t follow what you mean by 4 dollarific graphs.
Jack @ TheJackB´s last [type] ..Write What You Know
Really, really strong points Jack (I’d expect nothing less from you sir
), and I completely agree with the idea of a ‘plan’ before worry over a simple comment system.
But speaking of ‘plan’, because I do tailor to many newbie bloggers and business owners just getting into the online world, Livefyre is confusing to those folks, and it’s not their fault, and to those persons, I don’t think we can just say ‘suck it up’. See where I’m coming from Jack?
Personally, I think we need to tailor our blogs, comments, etc towards the paying customer. Ultimately, they’re what keep the lights on.
Thank you.
Gini Dietrich´s last [type] ..#FollowFriday: Brain Crushes
Thanks for the run down on Livefyre. I just discovered it a few days ago and was thinking of adding it to my new blog, which I may still do, but now I have some things to think about. I installed Disqus a while back on another blog and for the most part I like it, so perhaps that will be what I use. Great to hear everyone’s opinion on both.
I’m fairly new to social media and blogging, however I am a tech junkie…married to a developer. So I didn’t find Lifefyre to be intimidating but good to know that a lot of people do.
Thanks again for a great post.
Amber Goodenough´s last [type] ..WordPress – Search Everything Plugin
Hi Amber!! Welcome to the community here and I’m so glad this post came at the right time for you.
If you do end up going with LF on your blog, I’d love to hear if you’re happy with it or not, as well as what your community thinks too.
Thanks again,
Marcus
I’m a HUGE fan of Livefyre. I was one of the early beta users, switched it off when I had my blog redesign (purely from some missing functionality), and switched it back on recently, because the Livefyre team are awesome at listening to feedback.
As someone who praises the native WordPress comments system, here’s why I prefer Livefyre:
1. Real community. We all talk about communities on blogs (and Marcus, you do a great job with yours here). But communities (to me) are communal, and interactive. Livefyre offers this in spades because of the real-time updates and the ability to tag your friends from Facebook and Twitter, or from an earlier comment. As good as native WordPress is, you simply can’t replicate this.
2. Functionality for special events. I’ve had two Live Events where I’ve had special guests (David Garland and Geoff Livingston) hang about in the comments for an hour and answer questions in real-time from readers. This is like a town hall meeting and really makes you feel you’re in the same room as the person. Again, something native WordPress can’t do. (Disqus can but that’s a premium option).
3. Better threading. Any type of comment system has the same problem – threaded comments. If you have a lot – and I mean, a LOT – of comments, it soon gets difficult to know who’s replying to who. With native WordPress, you soon have to go to an “@” option to try and clarify. With Livefyre, you always know.
4. Reduces the amount of plugins needed. We all know that the more plugins we have, the more it can slow down our site. For native WordPress to offer the same functionality as Livefyre, you’d need: Comment Reply, CommentLuv, Tweet Comment, Facebook Notify, Social Sign In (and that’s just to start with). You’d then need something that shows social mentions too – immediately you’re at six plugins versus one – not my ideal scenario.
These are just a few reasons I love Livefyre. For me, my blog is for interaction, questioning and community – and Livefyre does that better than anything else.
Cheers, sir!
Danny Brown´s last [type] ..The Google Plus Apathy Malaise
Danny, boy am I glad you took the time to lay this out for everyone. Because I was getting wordy with my post, I didn’t have the time to include this in the article, but they’re really great features of LF that you’ve mentioned. And I was especially impressed with that ‘special event’ you did with Geoff. Almost like a live webinar yet it was on the spot. Very cool for all involved. (btw, who’s idea was that??
)
And as for the threading, that’s the one thing that really bugs me about WP. Take this post for example. Lot’s of whacky threads going on at this point that make no sense because they’re out of order.
Thanks again mate!!
Marcus
Cheers, mate – the idea was mine. The initial one with David Garland was a bit scary, as Livefyre was still in beta, but it held up admirably.
Danny Brown´s last [type] ..The Could and Need Effect
Nice bud, I think that would be cool to see again. Possibly with more bloggers. Or maybe a ‘blog-off’ between two folks debating the merits of a subject, with others interjecting….Hmmmm.
IT’S ABOUT TIME! I’ve been waiting and waiting and waiting for you to write on this one! Glad that it finally arrived.
Straight up, I’m not a fan of Livefyre or Disqus. I just don’t like the look or feel. And I’m not moved by the idea that everyone else uses it. Every time I go to a blog and realize that I have to log in, even though it only takes me 5 seconds…it throws me off a little. It doesn’t keep me from commenting…but I guess it’s just a matter preference and feel.
I do like how it allows for a better conversation view than traditionally offered through Wordpress. But not enough to make a move. Also, in my opinion it provides a layer of security because you have to log in which is something not present in the current wordpress platform.
I think Triberr is cool but it does somethings that I don’t like. For one, you and I had a tweet go out under Marlee’s tribe that said something to the tune of: “why I will never do business with Christians”. This went out while I was camping in hot/humid/sticky/bug-infested Nebraska (which I will NEVER do again) and John F sent me a DM letting me know that I sent out that Tweet. Upon learning of this, 3 hours later I sent out a tweet to renounce my support of that tweet publicly which led the author to reach out to me. The funny thing is that the Author is a Christian and was officiating a wedding the day of the tweet. The issue was that he crafted a terrible title. And that’s the issue right there…Tribal automatically attaches us to titles that we might not typically retweet.
Dino jumped in after I stated that I’m a member of Triberr and the Tweet was sent automatically. He said to pick your tribe mates carefully. I don’t think that’s the answer…good answer, but it doesn’t cover the entire dynamic. I think automating tweets has watered down what tweets were and takes away the personal touch where we add our own message.
PEACE
Jk Allen´s last [type] ..Conversations with Rob: Learning from a Multi-Millionaire
FYI Jk, there is a manual mode that would let you edit tweets, preview the shares from your Tribes. I don’t use Triberr but thought I’d let you know.
Hi Davina,
I haven’t dug deep into the manual vs. auto function yet…but I’ve always associated manual with going against what Triberr is used for anyway (automation). If I have to go into Triberr and Tweet a post manually, then I might as well just do so from the actual post…right?
Thanks for the note!
Jk Allen´s last [type] ..Conversations with Rob: Learning from a Multi-Millionaire
YW. Had this discussion a few times.. one of the reasons I’m not using it: I’d have to use manual mode in order to prescreen what I tweet which 1) is what I am already doing and therefore 2) defeats the purpose of using a tool. TEHO.
Davina K. Brewer´s last [type] ..Numerical Blindness
Exactly what I thought! See – then Manual mode renders Triberr pointless (in my personal view). That is unless others are willing to auto tweet you, that typically wouldn’t go to your site and tweet you. And really, that feels a bit one-sided.
I really need to think about this…to analyze if it’s something that I just use because it was hot…or if I really like the functionality. hmmmm!
Thanks!
Jk Allen´s last [type] ..Conversations with Rob: Learning from a Multi-Millionaire
Hey JK!
I saw that tweet and had a knee-jerk reaction too. When I read the article however I felt differently understanding the context. That said, you are totally right about automation – with the convenience comes a lack of control in some respects. And that point lends itself well to what Marcus is saying here, which is maybe why what we tweet is having lesser impact over time (regardless of our personal opinion) because we didn’t manage the content sharing ourselves.
Marlee´s last [type] ..A Simple Plan for Becoming Self-Employed (FREE Download Included!)
I’m with you 100% on this Marlee. And when I saw that tweet…I couldn’t believe it. I guess because I always keep in mind that I’m linked to 50 or so people through the Tribes I’m a part of and out of consideration and respect I wouldn’t want to compromise anyone because of an edgy title…so edgy to bring up religion in a negative context. But then again, should I have to hold back out of consideration? I really shouldn’t. But really, that’s the kind of cat I am.
Funny thing is the more and more tweets I get on each post, the lessor and lessor referral clicks I get from Twitter.
So yes, I’ve been hosed by the H20….or watered down.
PEACE
Jk Allen´s last [type] ..Conversations with Rob: Learning from a Multi-Millionaire
I think some of that is the responsibility of your tribe mates as well. I had a post the other day that had an unconventional title, Why The Subway Is My Toilet Stall. The content was TOTALLY innocuous, but I figured that not everyone would want to tweet that out. Made sure to jump onto Triberr and let everyone know.
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..5 Lessons From My Own Stupidity
Jk, sorry for the late response here, but this comment was awesome, as always, and very poignant with respect to the drawbacks of Triberr. The way I see it, if I’m going to go manual, I have no purpose using the system. And btw, I had no idea about that tweet, which is pretty embarrassing….eek.
We could go on and on about this one my friend, and I’m sure we’ll have more conversations soon.
Marcus
I think having to register for LiveFyre (or sign in with a different service) adds an extra barrier to people that aren’t avid bloggers/marketers. I did the same little experiment with my girlfriend and asked her what she thought about the system. She didn’t like the fact that you can’t just enter your name/email/site and comment.
I think its a great system and I’ve seen its effects all over the place, but I don’t think it’s quite as intuitive for new users quite yet. I’m sure it’ll get to that point though.
Eugene´s last [type] ..How to Time Your Tweets Like a Scientist
You bring up the perfect word in many ways Eugene— “Intuitive”. That’s exactly what a commenting system needs to be, in my opinion, to reach its potential. Notwithstanding, those that do take the leap love the system.
If you ever go LF bud, I’d love to know how it ends up for you my man.
Thanks for all your support,
Marcus
Marcus, Marcus… you know my thoughts on comment systems and Triberr. I’ve blogged it, don’t want to rehash anything, so I’ll just agree with what you’re saying and argue that it all depends.
Depends on the blog, the post, the blogger on whether or not Livefyre increases comments. 1) I’ve visited plenty of blogs lately and not seen a huge uptick in quantity of comments. Plenty, so I don’t think it’s a lock guarantee for more activity. 2) Even IF the quantity goes up, not sure the quality of comments does. Michael’s post – and follow up post today – case in point. Yes, I’m just as guilty of the blogjack fun sometimes and of course would like more comments on every post, but I’d still want a quality engaged community more. Unless there’s a bigger payday involved, then I might sell out.
There are things about Livefyre and Disqus I like, primarily the @name replies so that I can address several people with one comment instead of having to comment bomb the place. I like that they ‘save’ my comments, but only so far back and it’s not searchable. Other than that.. the look, the threading and nesting – which will vary per blog/site theme and format, the social mentions and tweets… lots of stuff I don’t care for. At least they DID change their email updates so I can set mine to ‘replies only’ rather than ‘never’ since they had my inbox begging for mercy.
Thoughts on comment and tweet inflation: I don’t think it’s inflation so much as escalation and dilution. Yes they are ‘only tweets’ or ‘just comments’ but then, they’re not; they’re my comments and tweets. From The Incredibles, ‘if everyone is special, then no one is.” IMO escalation, dilution, over-saturation does devalue things. FWIW.
Davina K. Brewer´s last [type] ..The Worst iPad App List Ever
I really like how you’ve introduced escalation and dilution into the discussion Davina. I can certainly see those words accurately describing the LF and triberr phenomena as well.
And btw, the Incredibles quote is perfectly fitting here. Really. And is everyone that special??
Have a great weekend lady.
Marcus
I’ve installed it but I don’t think I’ll ever have the intimidating party on my site in a month of sundays and that’s not what I am aiming for.
I would like to see a guest feature so that people don’t have to register to leave comments – that drives me nuts – Blogger comment system anyone?
I am contemplating removing it from one of my sites because I think it might just be too complicated for my audience. I remain undecided. My initial response when I saw it was “Urgh that’s ugly and messy” … can’t tell you when I changed my mind!
Ameena Falchetto´s last [type] ..Hey Marketer! Where are YOUR ethics?
A month of Sundays!? Can we get one of those??
Gini Dietrich´s last [type] ..#FollowFriday: Brain Crushes
I’m guessing I just made one of the faux pas’ I mentioned in my post today. “A month of Sundays” must a very English term. Oops. My bad.
Ameena Falchetto´s last [type] ..6 things to consider before taking on international clients
‘Ugly and Messy’—I think many folks have felt that before too with respect to LF. I think if they fixed that alone to me it would make all the difference. For example, the whole reason I use the ‘Thesis’ code is because it looks so ‘clean’ on wordpress. I want my comment system to match that, not take away from it.
But thanks so much for giving your thoughts Ameena. You add a really fresh perspective to this– a newer blogger using LF, something we see very little of at this point in the blogosphere.
Hope you’re having a great weekend.
Marcus
I don’t have anything to add to this awesome post because I’m in an echo chamber, but I have to say this made me laugh so hard:
“She literally thinks reading a Livefyre comment strand is like reading Spanish—she gets about 50% of what is going on.”
LMBO! HA! Love it. Um and btw, I get it and I still feel like it’s confusing.
Marlee´s last [type] ..A Simple Plan for Becoming Self-Employed (FREE Download Included!)
Yo miss, how’s my fav floridian doing?
That’s the thing. It is confusing. Do plenty of people ‘get it’? Yes, of course, but this doesn’t mean it’s a good fit or ‘gettable’ by everyone else.
Thanks for dropping by Marlee, look forward to seeing you in LA.
Marcus
All I can say is, Marcus, Livefyre is getting a lot of feedback because of this post. The primary message is this: make it simpler. Glad to have seen this as I get my new blog up and running.
Yes, that is a consistent theme coming up again and again here Bob. You know, I really think they need some super easy LF tutorial that anyone can see and click, visible in all their comment streams.
Marcus, I feel the same way as you about Livefyre. I love the real time nature of the comments, but I don’t like the way it looks. I don’t like the typography and the styling.
Fred @ SoloBizCoach.com´s last [type] ..5 Great Side Businesses for College Students
That can be amended with some simple CSS, to fit in more with your theme.
Danny Brown´s last [type] ..The Could and Need Effect
Danny, is there such a thing as ‘simple CSS’??
Seriously, if most business owners or part time bloggers here that phrase they’re going to run the other way. It’s great that it can be changed, but as many people have mentioned here, the standard look just doesn’t cut it for many folks– for whatever reason.
Livefyre actually inherits the the fonts and link style from your WordPress styles, so it’s completely up to the blogger.
Jenna Langer´s last [type] ..Recap from BlogHer11: Can’t stop blogging now!
I can see how Livefyre and Triberr could contribute to comment inflation. I know that I have to start ignoring my email once the comments become a frenzy. I would love to be able to read everybody’s comments, but some of them aren’t always in relation to the topic at hand, and I don’t have the time to read every, single one of them. (How Gini Dietrich and Danny Brown do so is something I would like to know.)
I don’t find Livefyre intimidating, although I know Danny turns off the point system for that very reason. I, unfortunately, have a propensity to want more points. That’s my competitive nature showing its colors. I think that could be another danger with Livefyre.
I use Livefyre on my blog because I like it better than DISQS. I’m not sure why. I think the decision was purely aesthetic. I also knew that Livefyre was the platform of choice on Spin Sucks, and I suppose I was trying to emulate that blog (Don’t tell Gini. I assume the revolution is still continuing.). My blog’s commenting platform was cumbersome, too. It had a CAPTCHA component that was very frustrating, and it didn’t allow for replies or an integration with social media channels. I wanted those things because I desired for my blog to be more welcoming, and I wanted people to be able to have conversations and discussions.
Erin Feldman´s last [type] ..Fierce or Christian Siriano Fierce?
Hi Erin,
Not sure about Gini, but I have elf clones to reply to most of my comments.
It’s a matter of placement – I’ll run a post up, and then go back to the comments later (usually in the evening), or if I have some free time in the day. While you don’t necessarily need to read and reply to each comment – or at least the one(s) you feel relevant – I think it’s just the polite thing to do, since you visited my place as opposed to the millions of other blogs you could have been on at that given time.
Cheers, miss!
Danny Brown´s last [type] ..The Could and Need Effect
Elf clones?! I could use some of those.
Thanks for replying. I feel the same way about comments received on my blog. I’m not in the “exponential” range – I couldn’t find the comment on Spin Sucks, or I would have replied to it there – nor do I expect to be any time soon, but I do like to respond to whomever has left a comment. I think it’s the nice thing to do. I want my readers to know that they matter, and that I value their input.
Erin Feldman´s last [type] ..Fierce or Christian Siriano Fierce?
I also have clones.
Gini Dietrich´s last [type] ..#FollowFriday: Brain Crushes
Maybe I’ll have clones some day. I’ll have to incorporate that into my business plan.
Erin Feldman´s last [type] ..Writers Write
I prefer minions and groupies to clones.
Jack @ TheJackB´s last [type] ..Blog Comments Are Not Currency
If The Island is any indicator, minions and groupies probably are a safer bet than clones.
Erin Feldman´s last [type] ..Writers Write
Hey Erin, sorry for my slow reply here, but I really appreciate your thoughts on why you chose LF, and also the fact that one of your main goals was conversations and discussions, exactly what LF is so great at promoting. And bottom line, I think the key thing is that you’re happy with the system, and ultimately, that’s our main goal.
Thanks so much for your incredible support Erin,
Marcus
No worries, and you’re welcome. I appreciate you taking the time to respond to my comment, especially when your post has a number of them. It was an interesting post, and the comments were insightful. I hadn’t thought about how Livefyre could be intimidating – I suppose because I didn’t find it to be that way – so that’s something I’ll have to remember.
Erin Feldman´s last [type] ..Writers Write
Skipping right to my comment without reading the others, Marcus; sorry, am on the fly. This post will get link love from me as it’s a topic I was going to write about tomorrow! But, I’ll wait.
Livefyre gives bloggers like me a chance to inflate comments like zany on guest posts elsewhere to the likes of 160 – 200+ range; it’s insane, and I work my arse off when I GP on blogs with Lifefyre b/c the pace is furious.
That said, I believe a blogger needs to graduate to such a system and be prepared for what it delivers. I elected for Disqus and am very happy with it. My comments are EARNED! My RTs remain lower in spite of being in Triberr, too.
So the nutshell becomes…what are your blogging goals? Increased traffic? Increased comments? More blogjacks? Or, steady stream of commentary without the one-sentence responses that Lifefyre promotes so well?
Jayme Soulati´s last [type] ..Obama, Boehner and Lessons for Business
See, I’ll disagree here, miss – I think a lot of it comes down to the blogger and how they’ve nurtured their community, as well as how they encourage discussion versus conversation (similar, but different).
I don’t see Livefyre as a “one-sentence commentary” option; far from it. Yes, it’s great for that type of comment, but it also fosters amazing discussion too. I’ve seen amazing, in-depth conversations take place via Livefyre, while the bloger can “take a backseat”, because it encourages more than just the initial readers to take part.
I’m biased, obviously, but I love the way my readers use Livefyre, and I’ve seen the same cool interaction elsewhere on other Livefyre-enabled blogs.
If the blogger hasn’t put in the effort to be welcoming and encouraging from the start (and helped with questions about changes to their blog), that’s their “fault” if they’re not enjoying the conversations they want. Just a thought, miss – look forward to reading your post.
Danny Brown´s last [type] ..The Could and Need Effect
Point taken, Danny.
Jayme Soulati´s last [type] ..Obama, Boehner and Lessons for Business
Danny, I just mentioned this to Jayme, but I think one of the great keys to success with any blogger, especially one that uses LF, is the ability to enable your community to have conversation when you’re not around. You’ve done this quite well my friend, and this speaks highly of your ability to empower others, and engender true ‘community’.
I’m not really sure what to say to this, coming from the woman who came to one of my blog posts and suggested people go to her guest post to comment. Smartie pants.
Gini Dietrich´s last [type] ..#FollowFriday: Brain Crushes
Really loved your final paragraph here Jayme, which, in many ways, goes back to one of my main points of this article– We’ve got to know our dang goals, otherwise it’s hard to make all the decisions that come with blogging.
But you also mentioned here a little trend I didn’t discuss in the main article, and that’s the idea of the time investment that comes with the LF pace, as it is furious (on certain blogs). If other folks step in and allow for the discussion to occur without the main ‘host’, (as Danny well stated below), then that’s great. But if the ‘host’ has set up the community so that nothing occurs without his/her input, well then there lies a problem.
Personally, I like being able to push publish on my blog and come back 10 hours later to jump in. Sometimes I jump in right from the beginning, but the option for both sure is nice, and I think bloggers need to be careful not to set their community up to be ‘host’ dependent.
Thanks so much for dropping by Jayme and hope you’re having a wonderful weekend.
Marcus
First things first.
1) That was a crap load of fun!
2) Nut-cake? Awesome!
3) VICTORY!
Now, as to the post, here is the thing… If I went out and bought a steak knife set and then turned around and stabbed someone with it, is it a bad knife? I abused the system and used it in my favor, but that doesn’t make the system bad (It makes me bad
)
While most commenting systems have made it so that it is easy to stay on top of replies directly back to you, they often suck at notifying you of overall follow ups. They come in one at a time and overflow an inbox (something I HATE). Livefyre found a better way to present this info. This made it easier for lazy bastards such as myself who would never think to check back to jump back into a conversation in a manner that doesn’t make me want to shoot myself when I open up my inbox.
I still think they have a lot of work to do when it comes to managing power sites like Spin Sucks and DannyBrown.me as the emails can be distracting and overwhelming. But when it comes to the average site, they’ve made it so that the conversation spreads beyond the blogger and the commenter. It delivers the info in a way that cross pollinates better than native systems.
I also count on my subway time to respond to comments, so I look forward to a time when they have reply by email as an option. That said, you’re going to be hard pressed to find a company more dedicated to making their product the best there is. I haven’t read the rest of the comments yet as I wanted to respond to you first, but I’d bet 5 bucks that Jenna Langer is already there…. Any takers?
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..5 Lessons From My Own Stupidity
5 bucks? Tightwad.
Danny Brown´s last [type] ..The Could and Need Effect
I was more concerned for anyone who would take it
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..5 Lessons From My Own Stupidity
Was it $5 Canadian at least?
I would never bet with monopoly money…
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..5 Lessons From My Own Stupidity
She has already commented, and I agree with Danny. $5? After almost deposing Gini yesterday?
Erin Feldman´s last [type] ..How to Find Your Voice
You know overthrowing Gini wasn’t a paying gig, right?
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..5 Lessons From My Own Stupidity
So you’re a pauper king? Bummer.
Erin Feldman´s last [type] ..Erin’s Guide to Grammar: Who’s Eating Whose Porridge?
Well on the plus side, I do have access to pearls…
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..5 Lessons From My Own Stupidity
Oh, okay. It’s all good then.
Erin Feldman´s last [type] ..Fierce or Christian Siriano Fierce?
Some friend you are.
Gini Dietrich´s last [type] ..#FollowFriday: Brain Crushes
Me? I’m the good child.
Erin Feldman´s last [type] ..Writers Write
Subway time- that is a foreign concept to people like me.
Jack @ TheJackB´s last [type] ..Write What You Know
And it is my stasis with the universe… Here’s to different walks of life!
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..5 Lessons From My Own Stupidity
I didn’t know Michael was so dedicated to Subway Sandwiches. But with a smart phone you can work from anywhere including Subway.
I am nothing if not loyal.
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..5 Lessons From My Own Stupidity
See, this is when Livefyre’s “like” ability would come in handy.
Erin Feldman´s last [type] ..Fierce or Christian Siriano Fierce?
A few things here:
- yes, I’ve shared my thoughts and answered questions on this post a few times already
- I don’t quite know who I’m replying to since there are no user mentions but I hope many of you see this
- looks like even without Livefyre the conversation can get a bit off topic
- I’m really sad the page is about to refresh when I post this comment (ok, I’ll admit I’m pretty spoiled with my own product and find it hard commenting on static systems)
That being said, it’s obviously more about the community than the tools, we’re just trying to make it more human with more interaction. All of this feedback is duly noted and I’m looking forward to feedback when our new registration process is up. It’s a challenge to make it simple and social, but I think we’ll succeed in this next version.
Jenna Langer´s last [type] ..Recap from BlogHer11: Can’t stop blogging now!
I agree with all your points Jenna that you’ve made regarding LF (although, this conversation has been 99% on point btw), and have personally been surprised so many folks have expressed a discomfort with LF, for whatever reason, it has been an interesting and telling conversation, and I’ve learned quite a bit. They great thing about your company Jenna is that you all listen very well, and work dang hard. That alone will take you where you need to go.
Cheers,
Marcus
Hey buddy, sorry so late on this reply, but you’ve been awesome in this strand, and this comment speaks well of the good and bad of LF, and of platforms in general.
And I must admit, although in many way it was pitiful what we did over at Gini’s house, it was dang fun. And I mean DANG fun. Whenever I go to Spin Sucks now, I click on popular posts just to remind myself of the day the little man had his voice heard by all far and wide, and etched said voice in the record books of the most popular PR blog on the internet. How can that not be a beautiful thing??
You rock buddy, I’m very, very glad we met an NCY Michael and am further glad to know there are freaks out there just like me.
Marcus
Late? It’s been two days buddy, cut yourself some slack
It was pitiful, but it was interesting. Don’t think I’ll ever look at comment count the same way again. Speaking of the little man, something I plan on working on for Falchetto’s 30 day challenge. Have some ideas that I may need your help on. Already roped in Gini and Danny, should be some fun (hopefully a little more meaningful this time around). Still wonder if Gini is adding an asterisk to her CSS 
Very glad that we crossed path and by the by, kick ass podcast. You so need to come talk to my entire industry at some point
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..Quick Quotes Weekly | The Never Happened Edition
I’m not a fan of commenting systems. I think the more plugins you load on, the more your site is likely to slow down. I notice at times when my internet connection is a bit unstable, Disqus and Livefyre both have a hard time loading.
And sometimes (not sure if it’s my internet, their site, the platform) there are just those little hiccups where a comment won’t post or I have to refresh the page a bunch of times to see if it did post. Even now, going to that article you mentioned from Michael, when the page loads it says there are 539 comments, but a few seconds later it reverts to 452 for some reason.
Also, not sure how Livefyre works, but I like knowing that comments are being stored in my database. I have access to email addresses if I want to privately reply to someone’s comment, and I can back them up and move them as I please. If I start a new blog, I can export some posts from my main blog to the new blog and the comments go with them. Not sure you can do the same with systems that save the comments in their proprietary systems.
Plus, I’ve seen Disqus in particular do some flakey things. I’ve seen two blogs now where the comments duplicated in the backend. On one site in particular, the comments not only duplicated, but comments from one post would appear on others and be completely off-topic. Only fix for both was to remove Disqus then manually remove all of the duplicates. And when you’re talking about thousands of comments, that’s a nightmare.
Anyway, my vote – vanilla plain commenting system. Less plugins, with exception to CommentLuv which always rocks!
Kristi Hines´s last [type] ..How to Measure Your Blog Growth
Kristi, sorry for my late reply to your comment here but I really like some of the points you’ve made. I’ve experienced the same thing with the slower internet. Disqus and Livefyre really struggle, plus both don’t do quite as well in certain mobile applications.
Also, I really like what you said about the odd display of comments with LF. That’s a great point. On the Spin Sucks homepage, it shows the article having about 80 more comments than it does when you’re actually on the article. Why the heck is that??
Thanks for rockin it Kristi and taking a moment to stop in here. I really do appreciate it and hope your weekend is an awesome one.
Marcus
Hey Marcus,
but as a newby, I started out with Livefyre and I’ve loved it from the start. I love how it shows the time of a comment, or the relative time and I love the New Comment flag that lets you know the person who commented may still be right there on the site so you can go back and forth with them. A new feature, which shows how many people are active on the site is great too.
Isn’t it interesting that a blog about comment systems can generate so many comments! But your blog posts always do – and you don’t have Livefyre.
I do love the emoticons
Does it stimulate more conversation? I’m not convinced it does. I comment on sites with all kinds of different systems. It’s not the comment system that makes me want to comment, but the post itself.
It IS more fun, though with Livefyre. No refreshing necessary! That’s nice!
Lori
Lori Gosselin´s last [type] ..How Do You Manage Expectation?
Great point Lori, there is an inflation when it comes to followers, comments, traffic. Big numbers means something in social media.
Not quite sure what but people attach a lot of importance to it.
Jack B makes a great point, what are you trying to achieve?
LF does facilitate comments but only for those who are already familiar with the login and are willing to create an account.
I know many business owners who wouldn’t know where to start with that. This disqualifies them from participating.
I agree totally it’s not the system which makes the conversation but the community and the blogger.
All good points Lori, and the fact that you started with Livefyre really puts you in a unique position to have a voice.
The real-time aspect of LF is amazing. No question about it. For conversation, there is nothing better, not even close, hence Danny’s ‘town hall’ meeting with Geoff Livingston. That was really, really cool, and couldn’t have been done without LF.
But thank you for taking a moment Lori to comment, I appreciate it very much, and hope you have a wonderful weekend!
Marcus
Unrelated side note regarding Triberr. While I get how you can look at it as something that simply inflates tweets, I think that may be a benefit of where you are traffic wise. While I’m sure it is contributing to your overall traffic, I would tend to bet it is somewhat of a marginal increase. Whereas for me, it got my traffic kick started.
Don’t get me wrong, it still often feels a little dirty to me, but I was nowhere with it before guys like you gave me a nod and took me into your tribe. But that likely raises another problem altogether, that it is way better for someone like than it is for you.
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..5 Lessons From My Own Stupidity
Thanks for adding your thoughts on Triberr bud. Here’s the thing: ‘It feels a little dirty to me’. I agree with that statement. And I wonder how many people are feeling the same. So why do we feel that way? Because we know it’s contrary, in many ways, to what social media should be– heartfelt sharing. Does it get traffic? Yes, but people now recognize a triberr tweet because it is a standard tweet, nothing added, no further commentary, just a tweet. And these days, ‘just a tweet’ ain’t much.
It will be interesting to see how the whole thing plays out. I still think they need to work out the kinks. Automatic is too, well automatic and as for manual, I’m not going to check the site every day… The idea is sound, pick the people who you’d want to share and nudge you to do so, but the execution while effective is likely too dirty… that said, it is cutting through a lot of red tape as a new blogger, so I can’t quite figure out what to do going forward… damn you greedy self interest, DAMN YOU!
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..Quick Quotes Weekly | The Never Happened Edition
Some interesting things to think about. What is a comment? Does volume matter?
I loved that Gini embraced the power of the people so graciously.
I coined the term for Livefyre (and Disqus) Conversation Engines because they enable them pretty much real time (Livefyre is better at real time). But this does lead to comment inflation. But I say this is good for 2 reasons. We all need to decide what we view as value. So even like yesterday to me the ranking on Spin Sucks as #2 most popular ever is not an ode to the content of the comments as much as an ode to the spontaneous crowd sourced event that took place.
And secondly in the past I browsed the comments and sometimes respond to a comment. I would comment. You respond. Done. For the most part. You couldn’t pull in people via Twitter or Livefyre account into a discussion. I sometimes do this to bring in an expert on a post begging their opinion (they hate when i do that LOL).So while the quality of all comments might be reduced when averaged, bringing people back once or twice or three extra times is a bonus. One for the page views and two for the quality of the over all discussion (my opinion)
Well put! Agree that there are downsides to these platforms, but they do take the interaction from comment to conversation.
Hadn’t thought about yesterday as a crowd sourced event. I guess if we look at the Derek Sivers TED talk, that would make Marcus the real maker of the movement!
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..5 Lessons From My Own Stupidity
Great comment. HAHAHAHAH! I kill me.
Gini Dietrich´s last [type] ..#FollowFriday: Brain Crushes
Howie, look at your getting all serious and stuff
Like Goofy Gini said, this was a great content. It was truly a ‘spontaneous crowdsourcing’, which is why I enjoyed it so much. And frankly, Livefyre made it possible. We could not have done that here on TSL. Yeah, we can have great conversation on a topic over the course of a few days (as we’ve had here), but never could we nail down 400 comments in about 30 hours. That’s nuts. And kinda cool.
Well done Schechter and thanks again Howie for the comment my friend.
marcus
So, glad you wrote this Marcus. For one thing, I owe Mrs. Dietrich an answer on why I am a Livefyre holdout (G, see Marcus above… and this comment!
)
The main thing Livefyre has over native is the tagging feature. I think that really does help engagement and pulling people into the conversation. There is no question it helps build a community, though as pointed out, you’ve managed to do quite well without it.
My main points against…
#1 I agree with your “intimidation” point — how many people are not engaging because Livefyre makes quick banter so easy and thus makes it easy for the conversation to divert off topic into banter and inside jokes? Unfortunately, you can’t prove a negative — you can’t ever know how many people didn’t engage at your site because it seemed like a big party to which they weren’t invited.
#2 An extension of #1, what is the effect of the “chat room” comment strains on the legacy value of a blog post? How do those comments being attached to the post when it is found 3 months later in Google make it stronger, or weaker? … Make it more useful content that supports the goals of the blogger — i.e. prospects, conversions, etc.
#3 Per Kristi’s point, doesn’t Livefyre put your comments on their system, and not in your database?
#4 Despite the increased spam, I like giving link love through ComLuv. Livefyre still restricts that to those who have its system.
#5 I am not sure Livefyre is a good choice for bloggers who do not put as much time into their blog. Even though the community theoretically takes over when the blogger is absent, that is probably less true for newer blogs. You have to be able to handle the increased engagement.
Per the above, Marcus, I guess I would put the question to you, since this is your area: do you think there are downsides from a content/Google/inbound standpoint?
In the end, I love Livefyre when I visit other sites (had a great time participating in the Schecter revolution) but still have reservations. I’m glad you wrote this; it is a conversation worth having. Can’t wait to see your response to all of these comments Marcus!
Now… off to tweet the people I mentioned since I can’t tag them.
Adam´s last [type] ..The Definition of Customer Loyalty
Hi Adam,
Quick answer on the “ownership” – Livefyre pulls from the WordPress comments loop, so even though you can moderate via Livefyre, the comments are always under your ownership and never “leave” your blog. So if you switch it off, your comments and formatting remain.
Thanks Danny. I think not keeping the comment database would be a big negative, so that’s very good to know!
Adam´s last [type] ..Customer Service Stories: Introducing The New Series
Thanks for being the LF ‘guide of the day’ there DB
Adam, epic comment man. Along with Danny’s, best of this post. Tone of thought you have here. In response:
1. YOU HIT THE NAIL ON THE DANG HEAD. People ‘assume’ they don’t lose folks due to Livefyre’s intimidation factor. That’s total bull. Every comment system does, even standard WP, but LF is the worst I’m sure. Unfortunately, that’s a stat none of us will ever know though, so people will continue to think their blog is ‘unaffected’.
2. Google reads comment strands. In fact, I’ve showed up on first page for certain phrases based on comments alone. But I’m not sure of their negative impact due to potential accidental keyword saturation….sounds like we need Cutts in on this one.
3. Nice response Danny Brown.
4. Like you, I really like CLuv.
5. Another interesting point. Sometimes folks feel like a blog is supposed to be baby-sat by the blogger so as to receive immediate replies. This simply can’t be the case for most folks who have this thing called ‘a life’
From an inbound standpoint, in many ways, a comment is a bad thing, believe it or not. Why? Because most true ‘business’ blogs should have a call to action at the end of the article. If the reader is busy leaving a comment, and not following the call to action, then an opportunity has been lost.
Again, awesome stuff Adam, thanks a bunch.
Marcus
Marcus, I think that there is a point in time at which we need to ignore some stats or subjective numbers. More importantly we need to answer the question of how much a comment is worth.
We know that most readers simply don’t comment. I am willing to bet that has less to do with the commenting system and more to do with a million different reasons that range from not being familiar with the topic to be intimidated by other commenters.
During the last three days I have had almost 3,000 unique users land on a post I wrote called the Cure For Insomnia. Not a single one of them left a comment- but I can tell you that more than a few spent significant amounts of time on that post and the blog in general.
When it comes to commenting systems I want three things:
1) Ease of use
2) Stability
3) Tools to build community
If it has those things I am usually going to be happy with it.
But that aside, while I try to make my blog reader friendly I don’t spend a lot of energy worrying about whether people are being scared off by banter because that is the sort of issue that occurs with any commenting system.
I am fearless when it comes to the blogosphere, but I don’t always leave comments on posts that already have hundreds. I don’t want to be a number.
Jack @ TheJackB´s last [type] ..Write What You Know
Jack, great thoughts man, and I’d hate to bug you with another question, but I’m really curious to know this: Exactly, just how much is a blog comment worth to you and what you do? I’m serious about this. As for me personally, I don’t know if I have an answer, but it’s one I’m going to figure out, and then hopefully write about it when I do.
Marcus, you can ask me as many questions as you want. I don’t mind when people are sincere are about it and I know that you are.
A while back I blogged about building my community around me because that is how I operate. I don’t spend a ton of time thinking about what my readers want to read or wondering if they are going to like my posts.
It sounds counter intuitive to do it that way but I believe that I end up with a more devoted group of readers than if I did it the other way. Since I run a personal blog that brings in business and not the reverse I have certain luxuries that others don’t.
If it was the other way around I would change my approach. Long story longer, I like blog comments and I value them. I rarely get upset with people who leave short comments, unless they are poorly disguised spam.
Good blog commentary advances the discussion and provides growth opportunities and I like that. But I don’t go crazy trying to make them happen. Most readers just won’t leave one.
Jack @ TheJackB´s last [type] ..Bald Is Beautiful & Other Things You Need To Know
Hi mate,
I think it’s a bit unfair to assume Livefyre is “the worst” – have you ever tried leaving a comment on the Echo comment system? Or you could ask Mashable how much their comments have dropped since reverting to their own white-labeled option (hint: it’s a LOT).
Again, I’d say it comes down to the blogger perhaps explaining the change to any system, not just Livefyre, and the type of audience the blogger has, from internal research.
I checked my Google Analytics and saw a lot of my traffic outside organic search came from Twitter and Facebook. So I knew even before I switched Livefyre on there wouldn’t be an issue, since people are already savvy in logging in via Twitter and Facebook.
And as Jack mentions, sometimes people just won’t comment, no matter how many reads a post gets. They might discuss it elsewhere (which is where Livefyre’s SocialSync comes in), just not on the blog.
And that’s OK.
At the end , Livefyre is just another tool for bloggers, though a damn fine one (in my biased opinion). The blogger still has responsibility to make sure his or her readers experience what the blogger wants them to experience, so if that means more information, fair enough. Or just leave the third-party option off full-stop.
Danny Brown´s last [type] ..The Could and Need Effect
Good point Danny, I should have said “It’s the most confusing of ‘the big 3′ “….
Thanks Marcus, for the kind words and the detailed response. I think Danny and Jack make some good points — and it’s definitely a matter of degrees and which set of pros and cons work for the individual blogger. At this stage in my blog’s development, I agree with most of your points, and don’t think Livefyre is the right choice. That being said, I think my blogging life is richer because it IS the choice in many of my favorite communities.
As for comments and SEO, wow… you might be more right than I ever thought. I discovered something interesting right after I made my comment here. I did a blog post on Aug 17 with a LT keyword in title. It was an announcement post and had comments closed. I then had a guest post (much more heavily promoted) with the same keyword phrase in the title and with 60 comments on it run on Aug 20. The post with no comments is on page 2 of Google results. The post with 60 comments is on page 7. Obviously, there could be other factors, but that blew me away. I will post details on G+ later.
Again, this is a great discussion. Thanks!
Adam´s last [type] ..6 Lessons I Learned in My First Six Months Blogging
I get what you’re saying…it’s the same reasons you’d choose Tumblr over WordPress. I do think it’s the best commenting system out there (and I’ve tried them all), but you and I have completely different goals for our blogs.
Gini Dietrich´s last [type] ..#FollowFriday: Brain Crushes
Adam does make a point… never would have known about this comment had he not manually gone to twitter and tagged me. Not cause I hate Adam or anything, but the comment and go mentality is very different from the conversational nature. Not to kiss Marcus’ ass here, but the fact that he has this much cross chatter going on in native WP comments speaks volumes.
PS The Schechter Revolution ROCKS. Need to start a band or something…
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..5 Lessons From My Own Stupidity
Yeah bud, as soon as I saw that ‘Schechter Revolution’ phrase, I thought, “Awww Yeah, that’s it!!!” BTW, is Gini OK Michael??
And thanks for the compliment on the cross chatter, but I’m sure it’s just carry-over from the revolution post
Marcus
I’m unfamiliar with her work…
Looks like I am soiling blog comments all across the internet. Livefyre be dammed! FTW!
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..Quick Quotes Weekly | The Never Happened Edition
You know, you could ask ME if I’m OK. Jeez.
Gini Dietrich´s last [type] ..#FollowFriday: Brain Crushes
#URaGoofBall
#ButILuvsYa
#ThatIsAll
We were just going for perceived care, not the genuine type
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..Quick Quotes Weekly | The Never Happened Edition
The nail never saw you walking up behind it, Marcus.
I love the ability to get replies via email and letting people know that I have answered back. The comment love part is great too, and the like feature is awesome—but I completely agree with the aesthetics you mentioned here. I hate to be a plain vanilla guy, but the WP comment system fits rather nicely as far as I’m concerned.
As for the value of a comment or a tweet, I am not exactly popular enough to garner 50 or 100 comments on a post. I actually feel pretty good about getting any at all, so knowing that this inflation concept is happening kind of hurts a little. I know there are people worse off than me, but it would be nice to know that the only think taking value away from my blog is me, not tools designed to do the opposite.
Brandon´s last [type] ..Game Time: Tackling the Past
Hey Brandon, great to see you here bud. BTW, if you’re not using the ‘replyme’ plugin with your site, make sure you do. It’s the reason this reply is landing in your inbox as we speak.
Sorry to depress you a little on the inflation thing though, but keep your head up. If you really spend the right amount of time building relationships, you’re blog will grow. If you spend all your time just writing content, it won’t. I know, hard to believe, but it’s the facts. As a new blogger, you should actually spend 70-80% of your time networking. If you do, you’ll grow way faster than if you post 10 times a week.
Make sure you subscribe here bud and let’s continue this conversation some more later.
Marcus
Oh, nice! Thanks for the heads up on the plugin!
You know, it’s funny you mention the networking and subscribing. I just got finished subscribing to several bloggers that I respect and look for (yours being one, of course.) I think I am firmly rooted into the concept of blogging. Now I am getting into refinement mode. Into the trenches I go! Wish me luck!
Brandon´s last [type] ..4L Dads – Jack Steiner (a.k.a. TheJackB)
Good luck Brandon, and if you need anything, please don’t hesitate to ask friend.
“If you really spend the right amount of time building relationships, you’re blog will grow. If you spend all your time just writing content, it won’t.”
I have to steal that line Marcus. I’m in the process of putting a post together about the value of comments… or comments as currency. This is the perfect quote to drive the point.
My blog is not in the same stratosphere as yours but I agree with what a lot of people have said about making it as easy as possible for people to comment. Many of my readers aren’t bloggers and if they have to share too much of themselves they’re intimidated.
I am the one crazy person who started on WP and moved to Blogger. I’ve toyed with going back but I’m holding off because I think Google will step up and make it as good or better than WP very soon. The one thing I hated on Blogger was not being able to reply directly to a commenter. I discovered I could add Disqus and that solved the problem. It’s actually easy enough that some of my shy readers have subscribed so they can participate in the conversation.
I’ve honestly never heard of Lifefyre before this post, but as I said… you’re in a different stratosphere. Based on what I’ve heard I believe I’ll stick with Disqus… and with Blogger for the time being.
As for auto tweeting from any resource… I find that very hollow support. I’m wondering if some blogs are just getting too big.
Thanks for another mind boggling post. Gotta run now…
b
Barbara, you’re way too good to me girl, but I certainly appreciate it, and am glad to provide you with a line as well.
Now that you’ve heard of Livefyre, I think you’re going to start to see it more and more. As blogs become more and more ‘social’, LF and other platforms like it will only continue to grow and ultimately dominate, I would imagine.
As for autotweeting, yeah, I’m bothered by it. Very hollow. A moral dilemma it gives me.
But thanks so much for stopping in Barbara, I’m always grateful to see you.
Marcus
I came over here after seeing Danny Iny’s tweet. I was one of the first users of Livefyre and loved it initially, the ability to bring a conversation to other platforms via it.
But just yesterday I uninstalled it. I had just too many problems with people not being able to – or not wanting to – login to comment. There’s no guest function like there is on disqus and all they say that’s coming, it’s not come for months now.
I barely use the full functions of it, e.g @ someone to bring them into the conversation so I’m not being that effective.
It also increased the load time of my blog substantially although that’s become better with their updates.
The team there are incredibly cool and supportive at getting back to me but I’m either heading back to disqus or trying out comment luv
Natalie Sisson´s last [type] ..What Is The Most Dangerous Thing You Can Do?
Hi Natalie, and my apologies for the late reply. I’m curious about the load time component of Livefyre. On one hand, it slows down regular load time and doesn’t show with slow internet speeds, on the other hand, it doesn’t have to refresh the entire page when a new comment is made. I guess quite the argument could be made for both in that arena.
But thanks so much for adding your thoughts Natalie, and I do hope to see you in these parts again.
Cheers,
Marcus
Hi, Marcus.
I’ve said it once and I’ll say it again. I am hopeless when it comes to things that looks kind of complicated, so I’m sticking with the WP commenting system.
See, I am a newbie myself and I don’t want to get caught up in Livefyre while I am still learning the ropes.
While I don’t mind commenting on sites using Livefyre or Disqus, but I get what you mean when sometimes all you just read is banter and there comments don’t just follow the sense of the post’s topic anymore.
But, I guess that’s what community is all about, huh? You could say what you want when you want and Livefyre makes it easier to do that.
Kim Davies´s last [type] ..What Being Positive Means in Life and 3D Rendering?
Hey Kim, sorry for my late reply to your comment here but I’m glad you jumped in the conversation. I can understand your desire to start off with standard WP, and I think that as the goals of your site develop, so will your thoughts on comments. As I mentioned in this article, I’m not finished I’m sure debating on which system I’ll be using.
Thanks so much for your support Kim,
Marcus
I remember that post Michael did over at Spin Sucks, I thought he had a great idea going on there.
But here’s the thing – I went to the Spin Sucks home page with the specific intent on leaving a comment on the most recent post. I saw that post, saw the immense number of comments, and left the site. I didn’t leave a comment. In actuality, I felt intimidated.
This also happened to a certain degree with Bill Dorman’s guest post at Life, for instance – there were over 300 comments by the time I got there, and if it wasn’t for the fact that I love Bill and Lori, I wouldn’t have left a comment there. Even so, the comment I left was pretty basic by my standards.
This actually happens to me whenever I come across a post which has a large amount of comments – I don’t feel inclined to add to the comments. They certainly don’t need the numbers, and if I added my voice, would I be heard?
In the past, this has also happened on a couple of Danny Brown’s posts, on a post at Think Traffic, and a post at ViperChill. I love those sites, and would gladly comment IF the numbers were lower. But because there are so many people at the party already, would my voice really matter?
To be honest, I’d rather go to another blog, with less comments, where my voice is more likely to matter.
Those are my two cents Marcus
Stuart´s last [type] ..How I Write A Blog Post
It makes me sad to read this, Stuart. Because I read every, single comment. So, while your voice might get lost to other commenters, it would never be lost to me. Ever. I respond to people who comment on blog posts that are months old. Every time. So I hope you’ll reconsider next time you see a large number of comments.
Gini Dietrich´s last [type] ..#FollowFriday: Brain Crushes
And I hope that more people were as interested in commenters as you are Gini. This made me smile, thanks
Perhaps it’s my introverted nature, but I just get a feeling of dread whenever I see a post of 200+ comments. Unless the post REALLY grasps me, it’s likely I won’t comment. It’s like turning up at a party and there’s 200 people already there, and all are talking.
Stuart´s last [type] ..How I Write A Blog Post
I’m an introvert too, so I totally get it. Sometimes I’ll see blogs (like this one) that 200 comments and decide to come back a day later. That way, everyone has had their say and my voice will stick out.
Gini Dietrich´s last [type] ..#FollowFriday: Brain Crushes
Hi Stuart – I totally get this feeling. I think that’s why a LOT of people don’t comment. The percentages vary on every blog, but usually a small number of visitors are comments.
I know that I’ve left blog posts because I didn’t want to churn through all of the conversation before deciding to leave one of my own. It’s time consuming to read through 200+ comments and, if you’re like me, you don’t want to be redundant and say something that’s already been said.
But, like Gini said, most bloggers are great about reading every comment. I know I do. You can sure bet Gini does. Don’t let the numbers scare you away. But, if you decide not to comment because of that, I think that’s fine too. In fact, I think you’re certainly not alone in the way you feel about it.
Laura Click´s last [type] ..Top 10 Excuses that Keep You from Starting a Blog
I don’t think I’m alone either Laura, and in a way this is why I’ve hesitated from installing Livefyre on my blog.
If I flinch when I see 200+ comments on a blog post, how can I expect my new readers to react? I try and make it easier for them to engage in the conversation by inviting their comments and thoughts, because I genuinely want to make each and every one of them feel welcome. With Livefyre, I don’t think I could do that.
Stuart´s last [type] ..How I Write A Blog Post
Stuart- that is my point exactly and why I disagree with Marcus. Quite a few people have the same feelings as you and will pass over commenting on posts that have a large number of comments on them.
The commenting system should be user friendly but ultimately it is not the final arbiter of whether people speak up or not.
Jack @ TheJackB´s last [type] ..Bald Is Beautiful & Other Things You Need To Know
Thanks Jack, I believe a lot of new ‘potential’ people will flinch at commenting on a blog where the party is well under way.
The problem is then, how do you change things around to make the big posts more ‘welcoming’ to new readers?
Stuart´s last [type] ..How I Write A Blog Post
That’s an excellent question. It’s not one I’m facing at the moment, but maybe someday I will (I hope.). I hope to hear what other people have to say because I, too, feel hesitant to comment on a blog that has a large number of comments. I don’t want to be repetitive. What I sometimes do, though, is reply to a comment or two that has been made. In that way, I’m still contributing to the community and acknowledging that I read the post.
Erin Feldman´s last [type] ..Writers Write
You know, for being the loudmouth that I am, I always want to be heard and I go through the very same thing. The other part I enjoy about a comment system like this is that I may find blogs I did not know about before. That is the biggest draw for me is that through comment systems like this one, I may gain a new reader or two.
I also like to post comments on smaller blogs where I feel I get heard a little bit better if that is any comfort.
Nancy Davis´s last [type] ..Can You Change Your Life In 30 Days?
I hear what you’re saying Nancy. Everyone has different needs when it comes to blogging, and each gets their own results.
About finding new blogs though, I’ve done that through WP commenting systems quite easily – I’ve discovered Mark Harai, Danny Brown and Paul Wolfe through the comments left on Marcus’ site here
Stuart´s last [type] ..How I Write A Blog Post
Stu, I know you’re off on vacation my friend, but I just wanted to express my gratitude for you having taken the time to leave this very sincere comment. It has really spawned a tremendous conversation and it seems like many, many people feel exactly what you do. So thanks for this and I’d be curious to know how your thoughts on this subject change over time.
Cheers mate,
Marcus
Thanks Marcus, it’s great that I’ve been able to contribute to the conversation in some way!
My thoughts have changed a little since Gini first replied, so my stance is now different. I appreciate that a lot of ‘big’ bloggers do their utmost to treat everyone with respect and attention, as you do here Marcus, no matter how long it takes.
Still, I’m happy that I started something here
Stuart´s last [type] ..How I Write A Blog Post
I’ve been taking a look at Livefyre myself. I currently have intense debate, which fits my needs, but I like the engagement that Livefyre tends to promote.
I think a lot of what you mention comes down to personal preference. I agree with the thought that there is an intimidation factor when one is required to log in to comment. That was my main reason for not going with Livefyre. I do understand they are planning to change that to allow anonymous commenting which will make it worth a second look when that feature is launched.
However, I also agree that there is an intimidation factor when commenting on any blogging system. Sometimes I think it’s up to the blogger to make a choice on their blog and then lead the way with implementation. I see many blogs that use livefyre, apparently successfully. My feeling is that whenever there is a change, there will be a drop off, but the people who like the new system will gravitate back.
Just a note on SEO. I had to dig deep, but Livefyre comments are indexed and crawled by search engines, which I consider a plus.
Richard´s last [type] ..Planning for Your Blog’s Financial Success
Richard, sorry for my slow reply to your comment bud but I’m really glad you took a moment to share your thoughts on this. I very much like your point on the fact that it’s up to the blogger to set the tone and really take charge of the commenting component of their blog. Also, thanks for that note on how LF comments are indexed. That’s a pretty important point.
Have a wonderful week Richard and I hope to see you come by here again sir…
Marcus
NP. Just to update my comment, I activated livefyre on my blog over the weekend to try it out.
Richard´s last [type] ..Track Your Website in Real Time with GetClicky
Marcus,
You make some great points on the inflationary factors of tweets and comments. I had never really thought about it, but what you say makes perfect sense. So much so that I wonder why I had never thought about it myself.
Personally I like the plain and simple look of the native wordpress commenting. It just seems…simple and easy. Livefyre, disqus etc. certainly do have their benefits, but I inwardly groan -just a little bit- when I see a blog I want to comment on has those.
Perhaps for me it is just liking what I am personally comfortable with.
Steve@Internet Lifestyle´s last [type] ..45 Tips to Make MORE Money with Affiliate Marketing
Hey Steve, great to hear from you bud, and I’m glad you got a little something from this article. And I’m curious to see how the process of tweet and comment inflation will develop over time.
Like you said, there is a little something in you that simply doesn’t like LF and Disqus. I get that. And I’m not fully sure why it is, I just know a lot of folks feel it….Can we’ll see how the psychology of blog comment platforms develop as well….it should be quite interesting.
But thanks again Steve and I hope you have a tremendous week my friend.
Marcus
I would totally send the Chicago mafia after you if not for the third point about emoticons. Because that made me laugh. Out loud. I may have even snorted.
But I don’t think you can use the Shrek/Gini example as what’s wrong with Livefyre. I mean, you commented like 25 times with one word per comment. That’s a Marcus issue, not a Livefyre issue (and totally cheating too, BTW).
You and I have this conversation a lot and we all have different goals for our blogs. I’ve tried all sorts of commenting platforms and I like Livefyre the best because it invites the dinner conversation that Jenna mentions. I want that. I want Spin Sucks to be the go-to place to have intelligent conversation, but to not take ourselves so seriously. I don’t like the idea that it’s intimidating to jump in, which is why I do my very best to make everyone feel welcome, even if they have different views than mine. That’s not a Livefyre function; that’s a Gini function.
I’m totally cool with the banter and the silliness. You can actually watch it. It starts out pretty serious and intelligent and, around 2 p.m. every day, it goes downhill. Quickly. That’s not because of Livefyre; that’s because people know they can come comment and have fun.
THAT is what community is about and Livefyre helps me do it better. I also don’t want people guest commenting so I’m cool with not having that option.
Gini Dietrich´s last [type] ..#FollowFriday: Brain Crushes
I believe with my full heart that Gini has actually had conversations with whoever does the development for Spin Sucks to have an asterisk added next to my now #1 most popular post. I am the Barry Bonds of Spin sucks.
For the record and to be serious for a change, I learned how to comment on Spin Sucks and a big part of that is the sense of familiarity (may be a little of that here too Marcus
). There can be an utterly serious comment right beside an idiotically hilarious one. So yay to the Gini and Marcus functions!
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..Quick Quotes Weekly | The Never Happened Edition
Hey girl, sorry to be late in replying to you here, but let me make a couple of final points:
1. I love banter. I love your blog. And I think you’re a top-notch manager.
2. Any time, and I really mean any time there are many folks commenting, some folks are going to feel ‘left out’. It’s impossible to eliminate completely. I’ve asked many folks here how they would manage things differently and no one has had a solution…which goes back to the reality that certain people will always feel ‘not a part’ of aspects to society.
3. I get the log-in advantages. One thing no one here has brought up is I could steal someone’s gravatar, or they could steal mine, with standard wp. That’s stinking scary as heck.
4. You’re pretty and have nice teeth.
The end
You just gave me the BEST idea!! And…you have nice teeth, too.
Gini Dietrich´s last [type] ..A Gigantic Hole In the Online World
Didn’t know you were an economist in your spare time Marcus
Tom Ewer´s last [type] ..Corbett Barr’s Million Dollar Blog Project
There’s so much more still to tell Tom
Interesting thoughts here, Marcus. I have not yet joined the Livefyre bandwagon because I have had similar thoughts as you. One of the main reasons I don’t use it on my blog is because there are certain places where Livefyre is blocked for me. If I’m at a location that blocks Facebook behind a firewall, I can’t leave a comment on a blog that uses Livefyre. I would suspect there are a lot of corporate environments that still block facebook, so I don’t want to have the problem of readers being unable to comment because of access issue.
I do think the think Livefyre really does a great job of driving engagement thanks to the tagging feature. It gets you drawn back into the conversation. With other commenting platforms or vanilla systems, you either just get replies or see all comments. And, if you’re like me, I can’t read all of them that come through. So, getting tagged makes me go read the comment. Because of this, I think blogs with Livefyre will definitely see a lot more comments. And, I’m sure that some do this just to drive the numbers up.
However, to a newcomer to your blog, I can see how Livefyre may feel like an insider’s party if you don’t know how to jump in. It is confusing and feels much more like a chat room than a commenting system. It almost feels like you need to know everyone at the party before you say something. While that can be a good thing, I do think that it can make it scary for some folks.
I use Disqus because looks nice without me having to bring in a developer to improve the look of my vanilla WP commenting system. I do wish, however, it integrated with CommuntLuv. I miss that plugin dearly.
Laura Click´s last [type] ..Top 10 Excuses that Keep You from Starting a Blog
Hey Laura, sorry I’m late replying to your comment here, but hopefully you’re having an excellent holiday weekend.
I really thought your comparison of LF to that of a ‘chat room’ vs a ‘comment system’ was a excellent one. That,in many ways, sums it up. I think depending on the goals of the blogger, they need to figure out what the purpose of their comments in relation to this goal.
Again, thanks for your thoughts Laura and hope your week is a great one.
Marcus
Hey Marcus,
You make some great points and since I changed to LF you know we discussed this a few times.
First I think you are right LF is a barrier to entry for non-tech people. Here I’m not talking about the retired pensioner but business owners who use email, google and FB for their friends.
On the other side we need to define what is a comment?
As Gini points out, you leaving one word comments on Michael’s post doesn’t constitute a comment to me. It’s more like friends heckling each other rather than a discussion.
Which brings me to Stuart’s point, when you have a group of people who all know each other well throwing inside jokes and making fun of each other on a blog, I believe it scares the lurkers away. Saying this Stuart isn’t even a lurker as he knows everyone here and comments regularly.
So we can only imagine the number of people whose voice we never hear because they feel they just crashed a private dinner party.
Is it Livefyre’s fault? Would Disqus change that or WP comment system? I don’t know but it’s true that LF allows this type of banter to get out of hand quickly with no refresh capabilities the discussion grows fast.
So do people kill people or guns kill people?
Way to steal my point Falchetto
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..Quick Quotes Weekly | The Never Happened Edition
Hmmmm…do comments kill websites or do websites kill comments?
Steve | ROI detector´s last [type] ..Get 400,000 "likes" for your Facebook Page
I read this and it makes me want to install livefyre lol but Im too lazy to change from DisqUs …
Im hoping livefyre lights a fire (hehe) under DisqUs’ ass and DisqUs actually steps up their game.
Dino Dogan´s last [type] ..Google And Facebook Are Forcing You To Have Sex With Your Cousin
Yeah, Disqus does seem to be stepping up a little though Dino, but how does a company like Disqus make any money? How do they cover the costs of development? That’s really something I’d like to find out.
G’Day Marcus,
I dunno about comment inflation and all that sophisticated stuff that youse Yanks go on about.
I do know that Livefyre is downright commenter unfriendly. Having to go through Livefyre’s hoops merely to leave a comment leaves me cold. LF also has a nasty habit of deciding, every so often, for no apparent reason at all, that I’m not registered with them-which I have been for some time-and automatically rejecting my comment. And in my experience they aren’t very helpful when one complains direct to them.
Sorry to be so serious mate. But you struck a chord.
Avagoodweegend
Regards
Leon
leon Noone´s last [type] ..10 Signs That Your Systems Are Stopping Staff Performance
Hey bud, nothing wrong with being serious at all. No question, LF can be glitchy, and uninviting to some. Others love it. So were all different. But it’s interesting you say that you haven’t been impressed with their customer service, as many people I’ve talked to say how much they like the folks there. Personally, I’ve not worked with them on a tech-assistance level.
Hope you’re Sunday is a great one my friend.
Marcus
Hi Marcus, et al
I have invested the rather long time it took to read this post, the comment stream, as well as the posts on spin suck by Gini and Michael. All terrific for someone, like myself, that is just starting out. The key take-away I have from all of this is that there is no one-size-fits-all solution … or at least not yet. The commenting system hasn’t been perfected (to that kid in the Ukraine reading this … go build it son!!). There are trade-offs. But … are they insurmountable? I don’t think so. We need to step back (the developer in me says what are the requirements here). Based on what I have gathered, and without putting much of my own still immature thoughts into it, I have the following as a list of functional requirements for the ideal comment system:
(1) Holds span in check. Is hard for non-humans to participate.
(2) Encourages participation in noobs and experienced folks.
(3) Connects with users identity on other systems IF THEY WANT IT TO (primarily fbook and twitter … maybe g+ soon)
(4) Threaded
(5) Allows for non-spam “spam” to be added, but somehow minimized from non-participants (i’m think of the inside chatter funny ha ha stuff between 2 commenters that have no relevance or interest whatsoever). Maybe it would be enough to allow these commenters to tag them as “not relevent” to the post somehow?
(6) Comments owned by the post (in db)
(7) Allows for the addition of things like commentluv in the text
(8) Collects an email … although i’ve often wondered on this one. We all know why we want someones email, even though it can often be a dud. And asking for this social currency to be spent must surely prevent some impulse commenters from taking action.
(9) Gravatar support
(10) a simple customizable look and feel
I also like the idea of a grading system for comments … simple thumb up/down probably suffices … with better comments rising. This might have the effect of burying the insider chatter as well. I’ve seen this on other sites, notably q&a type sites and, until recently HackerNews. I think new viewers should be able to filter comment threads too — possibly based on such a value.
Cheers — great site Marcus (i’m new here) and thanks for making me aware of spinsucks too. I’m gonna snoop around there too.
Werner
I assure you Werner, Spin Sucks is only uphill from my post
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..Quick Quotes Weekly | The Never Happened Edition
Thanks for the heads up on this Michael. You got that self-deprecating (but not really) thing going on … a strategy I’ve used since grade school
. Cheers !
It’s a good strategy and is exactly why I’ve stayed in grade school all these years…
Michael Schechter´s last [type] ..Finding Your Kabuki Mask
Hey Werner, sorry for my late reply sir, but this comment was simply excellent, and you’ve basically come up with what I think is an almost perfect summation of what the majority of the folks here are looking for. Seriously, this was great.
Also, your ‘irrelevant to post’ idea is an awesome one. I’ve never heard anyone say that before and it actually makes a ton of dang sense. I think another would be that viewers had more control as to what they saw somehow. In other words, let’s say a viewer doesn’t want to see strands, just first comments, that might be a nice feature.
So more control from the reader’s end makes sense, although I can see how that’d be tough to develop.
Again, thanks for this Werner. It was great and I hope your week is a tremendous one and you’re able to come back to these parts of the net again.
Big cheers,
Marcus
Thanks for the reply (and kind words). The week is indeed awesome and super-crazy-busy as the boys are off to school (grades 1 and 2) and super-girl (almost 2 yrs old) is really wondering where they went after a summer of toddling behind them pretending she was big too. I’m sure you can relate
I was thinking about what you said about “reader control” perhaps being a cool feature … and I’m pretty sure that would NOT be all that hard to code up. This is a great debate, and I see merits on both sides. I did notice that LF has added a pseudo comment luv like feature (and I think Danny Brown is using it, but not Gini Dietrich – yet anyways). The catch (isn’t there always one) is that the luv only comes from the commentors blogroll *IF* they are another LF blog. A clever response.
Thanks again for you reach back to me. Wishing you and your a happy happy.
Hi Marcus,
I installed livefyre a couple of months ago, and overall it’s been very good, but the conversations here brings up reservations. I guess all of the popular blogs have this going on, but I see the clique-ish conversations happening and I don’t want any reader to think they can’t comment because they are interrupting a private conversation. This worries me greatly.
I see a lot of back and forths between the same people and, frankly, I almost feel like I am intruding if I have something to say. I hope I am wrong here, but I am concerned about beginners who may feel intimidated. Guess I just want an all-inclsive blog.
Excellent post and you made me think. : )
Judy Dunn´s last [type] ..Why Keeping Livefyre for My Blog Comments Is Good for You
Judy, you nailed it.
Would have “liked” your comment if I could have. : )
Judy Dunn´s last [type] ..Why Keeping Livefyre for My Blog Comments Is Good for You
Judy I think that is the battle that blogs with active commenting communities fight. There is no way to build a community without creating banter that leads to the appearance of cliques and inside jokes.
As blog owners we can try to reach out and send emails to new commenters and do other things that provide a personal touch, but that is not a guarantee. Nor is it always easy to do not because of desire but because of time.
It is tied into why I don’t believe that comments should be used as currency, but that is a different topic altogether.
Jack @ TheJackB´s last [type] ..Bald Is Beautiful & Other Things You Need To Know
You see, that IS the dilemma. Cultivating that sense of community without alienating your newcomers. i really, truly want a community where everyone’s voice is heard (every voice that wants to be, that is). That extra “fairness gene” I got makes me want to be sure that all readers feel valued equally. And it’s also tied to the regrettable fact that 90+ percent of my readers never leave a comment. I’m just hoping that isn’t one of the reasons.
I love the healthy banter and the relationship building that comes with the interactions of a relatively few comments. But I want others to join the party, too. Guess I just want it all. : )
Judy Dunn´s last [type] ..Why Keeping Livefyre for My Blog Comments Is Good for You
I like what you’re saying, but how do you prevent that when you have loyal readers and commenters Judy? How do you prevent folks from really getting to know each other and forming the normal communication habits friends do? I think that’s the tough part of this, as it’s not like someone like Gini could come out and say, “OK everyone, you need to be more inviting to others…and stop having so much fun….and none of that silly talk you keep doing!” …Do you know what I mean? It’s such a tough question and honestly I don’t have an answer.
Thanks so much for this great comment Judy.
Marcus
I know, I know. That’s why this question is so complicated and why I really appreciate it that you posed it. I would love my blog to be a platform for debate and discussions (serious or not). But sometimes I wonder if the blogger couldn’t do a little more (not you, Marcus, and I have no particular blogger in mind when I say this) to bring the discussion back on track. Because sometimes I see it degenerate (perhaps that isn’t the right word) into personal replies to the point where the topic of discussion is lost. And that is the point where a blogger loses some of the people who might have wanted to jump in. Not even sure if this makes sense, but I’ve been thinking a lot about this lately—actually the whole issue of commenting. What a great discussion here. : )
Judy Dunn´s last [type] ..Why Keeping Livefyre for My Blog Comments Is Good for You
Your thoughts make perfect sense to me. When I was in the creative writing program, I had to take several creative writing workshops. Some of the professors were very good at managing the workshop discussions; others weren’t. I still remember one of those “others.” Several of my classmates and I were absolutely mortified and hurt by the conversation – even though it had no direct relation to us – because the professor refused to step into the conversation and to turn it back into something constructive. It’s very possible that something like that could happen in a blog’s comments, which, I suppose, is where the moderator comes into play. That person has to decide from the get-go what behavior will and will not be tolerated and abide by those rules no matter how “hairy” the comments get. I, too, want my blog to be a place for serious and not-so-serious conversations and discussions. I’m still determining how best to do that.
Erin Feldman´s last [type] ..Writers Write
With you all the way Judy, and when you get you get this all figured out, I’d love to hear your thoughts on it…with a post on your site. One thing is for sure, this is a topic that will only continue to develop more and more and more with time.
Glad to see that guest commenting will soon be possible with Livefyre. I want to comment with the minimum amount of fuss possible. New commenters do not want to be intimidated as Judy refers to.
Michael Said´s last [type] ..I Am The Customer
Yep, I think it’s going to be a big move for them Michael, and much needed.
Thanks for dropping by bud, and have an excellent Sunday.
Marcus
Marcus, I’ve got 3 takes on this; you know how I am.
First and main take is that I don’t like any system that makes me subscribe to I can be everywhere, if you will. In other words, I like your present comment system, which is what I have on all my blogs, and it’s what I’ll always have.
Second take, I don’t think having too many comments is a bad thing, Livefyre, Disqus, or as you have it here. I still see all comments being legitimate as long as their not automated and spam or, well, just lousy comments with a few words. If people are engaging, no matter how, it’s all good.
Third, well, one of your commenters, Stuart, kind of summed things up. While many people don’t want to comment on a blog with no comments, many also don’t want to comment on a post with tons of comments. As he said, you start to feel lost. We both know that some blog owners won’t even look at the comments, so whether it’s 4 or 300 those comments are just there. Some others might look at a number of comments up to a point and move on. Either way, I don’t think the value of the comments goes down if there are too many; you might eliminate some people later on, but you never miss what you never had, if that makes sense.
Mitch Mitchell´s last [type] ..Spreading Influence In More Ways Than One Online
Hey Mitch, good to see you, as always man. I think you and I share some very similar thoughts on this stuff. Standard wordpress, with the right plugins, sure is a nice, clean system. But also, I think it’s important we keep our eyes open to what’s available to us and what might be.
Have a great weekend my friend and continued success with your blog.
Marcus
While I agree that services like livefyre and Triberr inflate the value of a comment or a tweet,it has been the case for a while with a more basic function: author responses. Everytime an author responds to a comment or retweets their own post, they are inflating the number of tweets and comments. Certain bloggers have bragged about having a 100 comments when half of them are their own.
The value of a comment should be based upon the content of the comment.Not all comments and tweets are equal
I fully agree James that author responses is another source of comment inflation. I’ve seen blogs where it appears the author is intentially beefing up the comment numbers by throwing LOLs and such as a reply to other 1 word comments. Personally, I do try to reply to all legit comments, but I’m certainly well past the point of needing the validation of the comment number, if that makes sense.
Good to see you btw James, hope you’re well bud.
Marcus
I find it funny that blog comments have grown along with blogs. Back in the early days of blogs, it was difficult to find good content so one would think that the good blogs would have been swarmed with comments. And with great content so prevalent, one would think that blogs would be getting few comments (don’t worry Marcus, this is still one of my favorite blogs
).
Perhaps people are finally figuring at that Social Media requires active participation and are getting use to commenting. I’m not yet sold on Livefyre or any closed commenting system, but I could be totally wrong (and yes I do have an account with them and Disqus). I do have to second the “ReplyMe” plugin for WordPress though, seriously awesome.
Steve | ROI detector´s last [type] ..Get 400,000 "likes" for your Facebook Page
Actually I would argue that prior to FB, Twitter and other social media platforms most blogs received far more comments than they do now.
Jack @ TheJackB´s last [type] ..Bald Is Beautiful & Other Things You Need To Know
That would be pretty interesting to compare average number of comments over time. I’m sure there’s a huge range, some blogs getting hundreds while others are a barren wasteland of interaction.
Steve | ROI detector´s last [type] ..Get 400,000 "likes" for your Facebook Page
It would be interesting to have hard numbers to review as opposed to just speculation.
Jack @ TheJackB´s last [type] ..Bald Is Beautiful & Other Things You Need To Know
Hey Steve, good to see you bud. I think that yes, blog commenting is starting to become more the ‘norm’, but it’s still not done by over 90% of readers on any given blog. It will be interesting to see how things change in social media and comments in the coming years. Either way, I’ll be talking about it.
Cheers brother,
Marcus
Holy monkey nuggets there are a few comments on this post, with or without Livefyre. So to answer the questions…
I have used just about every commenting system out there on my blog and am sticking with good old fashion WordPress comments. The reason I installed Livefyre before was for the real-time conversations, but when it comes down to it I don’t get a ton of comments on my posts. And that’s fine as I’m not using that as a measure of success. Also not everyone wants to leave a comment – many come for the infos and then take off. That’s fine too.
Now I’m a huge fan of Triberr. It has helped me to get in front of more fantastic people and not only meet the fans of my fellow Triberrites but also meet very excellent Triberrspeople (?) too.
As for comment and tweet inflation frankly I wonder how many people look at these numbers anymore. Though I know I’m deluding myself as a number of people view it as an “influence” score or whatever, though it’s totally bogus. That and I don’t need Triberr to manufacture tweets if I wanted to, which I don’t.
At the end of the day what is the goal? To get more people to read your post? To get more people to opt-in to your offers? To position yourself as an authority? To create a community on your blog?
Whatever it is there are tools to help with that. LiveFyre and Triberr are only two.
Robert Dempsey´s last [type] ..The Only Hats An Entrepreneur Should Be Wearing
Robert, great to hear from you brother, as always. I noticed you had changed up commenting systems a few times in the past months and I’m glad you’ve noted your experience here.
I like how you talk about goals here too. I know your main goal is customers through content, not customers through comments, two very, very different things.
Thanks so much for dropping in brother,
Marcus
Ya know man, I never thought about how fast Heinz makes ketchup. This post made me do that!
Yea, I think Triberr has definitely devalued the tweet. I used it for a week, then took a serious long term look at how it would effect my stature and other things, and destroyed my account. But of course, there are awesome benefits to it. For some, not for others. Simple really.
Livefyre. Who knows! I really like the community thing. I like how it promotes real time kind of “live fire” engagement. However, I don’t like being interrupted 8 times in an hour from an email that comes in telling me I have a like or a response. It’s making me Tim Ferriss my online operation! (Four Hour Work Week, batching email and minimizing minutia)
I won’t be messing with LiveFyre anytime soon. I won’t get it because it seems to be becoming status quo, or at the very least popular. I’d rather look at it from the perspective of knowing that coming to my own conclusion is more important. Na mean!!
But dude… sweet post, great points, rock on.
I totally think lions are cool.
Ryan, love your style man, and yes, Lions do rock.
I appreciate your thoughts on Triberr. It’s a moral dilemma for many folks, and it has been for me too. I certainly do want to have a legit and strong stream on my twitter account. Guess we’ll see on that one.
Regarding Tim Ferriss, good analogy man. I can tell you this, Livefyre, in many ways, is the antithesis of the Ferriss approach. Livefyre can really suck some time out of its ‘host’ blogger, unless the blogger manages the community in such a way to be self-reliant, not host reliant.
Well I hope you keep coming back man, really appreciate the words.
Marcus
Usually I wouldn’t take the time to leave a comment when they’re already so many, but what drew me to your blog was the reference to Livefyre so I’m compelled to add my two cents. First, I’m also hanging in there with WP comments for all the reasons already mentioned. To be completely honest – even when I come across an article that I’d love to comment on, if I see they’re using Livefyre I move on – it just seems to complicated and intrusive – and since I’m still in the early stages of building my blog community I need to keep things as pain free as possible for my readers.
marquita herald´s last [type] ..Time to Revisit, Rethink, Rejuvenate Goals
Hi Marquita, I’m honored you decided to take a moment to comment here despite the large participation to this post.
I think your thoughts on Livefyre is representative of many folks. Whether it’s truly is ‘too complicated’ or not, it does come across that way to some folks. And you know what they say— ‘Perception is reality’.
Thanks again for dropping by Marquita.
Marcus
Having spent a lifetime analyzing media and marketing research, my two cents worth is that everything mentioned, and more, is killing validity of Stats. Where is the target audience in all this? I belong to a social media group that visits each others Facebook Fan Pages each Friday .. and there is not doubt that all the Stats are skewed by it. Sure, you see a spike on Friday and you know what it is .. but it all gets rolled in to the big picture. You think you are doing great SEO and drawing in Search Engine traffic .. wow, look at those numbers .. my site must not need any work. Wrong! If Triberr and Livefyre (and link groups of any kind) are in the mix your Stats Tracking is tainted.
I’ll take all Blog Comments that are relative to the topic. But I’m still practicing true organic (or natural) SEO to get high Search Engine Ranking Positions SERPs. They are skewed as well because all these un-natural traffic methods eat up a LOT of time. Time these folks could be querying search engines.
Linda Yarbrough@Media Marketing Strategy´s last [type] ..Blog Commenting with CommentLuv
Hi Linda, and a big welcome to you.
Being a ‘stat’ person, I can see why this is a topic of interest to you. I see people using Livefyre talking about traffic increases, but the real ‘tell’ for the effectiveness of a website is:
1. New Visitors
2. New Customers
If those two numbers are high, life is good. But if the same folks, who never buy, just keep coming back again and again and again, only to raise page views and a blogger’s “self esteem”, has anything really been accomplished?? I’m not saying this happens every time with LF, but it’s certainly an issue.
So grateful you stopped by Linda to share, I do hope you’ll come back again.
Marcus
I just had to wait until my friend Linda (above) commented because the biggest reason I wasn’t sold on going beyond WordPress with CommentLuv (which I LUV). I attempted using IntenseDebate and wasn’t impressed. I kept liking what I was reading about LiveFyre but was very concerned about the increased spamming potential, not to mention the fact that I want to build a community feeling on my page, but not at the cost of ‘going’ too social.
This was an excellent post and the discussion alone was a wonderful convincing argument about the validity of sticking with what works, simply.
Katrina Moody´s last [type] ..Writing Corner Expressions | In the Silence
Hi Katrina!! I’m honored you took a moment to come by here today and am glad this discussion helped you a little bit as well.
Like you, I don’t like Intense Debate at all. It’s very confusing and niche like in my opinion, and I’d actually take Livefyre before I took Intense Debate.
But good luck with building your community Katrina, I’m sure you’re on your way!
Have a great week coming up,
Marcus
Thanks for your reply Marcus. A good friend and I have talked this out extensively and I just don’t feel comfortable moving to a full system at this point for commenting. I deal with so many new bloggers and those I call baby bloggers in my niche and I’m afraid it will be a little much to hit them with more login in requirements and a more complicated format.
Thanks again. I am really loving your site here!
Marcus! Is yooo crazzzy??!!! 244 comments and you have replied to every one of them! I know a lot of folks clearly don’t understand this simple etiquette when I see 4 comments and the admin hasn’t even responded to those but this is one of the reasons for your popularity. Quite simply, you care enough.
(There is definitely a sincere compliment in there amongst the comment about your sanity!)
I am with you on Livefyre. I have enjoyed it on other sites for all your reasons but I can’t commit just yet for the aesthetics. Although I ‘get it’ now it just doesn’t look simple. I’m also loathe to have to keep offering more things that folks have to sign up to as it irks me to have to do so repeatedly. All the best.
pea´s last [type] ..Donna Karan’s Manhattan Apartment
Hey Pea, kind words, and I really appreciate it. I’ve always felt that if someone takes the time to comment here, and is sincere with their words, then it’s only right for me to reply. Community means so very much to me.
Thanks so much,
Marcus
I must be getting old Marcus but I just don’t get LiveFyre, it seems a mix of all things social and commenting i.e. it’s not one thing or the other. It’s trying to be all things to all people and I kinda don’t like that. Perhaps I’m just a traditionalist but I’d rather enjoy a good ole debate round the comment table where we can bat things back and forth and share other viewpoints. Livefyre is like having a chat with friends but stopping to add what’s being said and connecting to social media as you go thus breaking away from the conversation in front of you . For me it’s not real or right and perhaps not everything ‘popular’ is the correct fad to follow. Yours truly, old man Sherry!
John Sherry´s last [type] ..Why It’s Right To Be Selfish
Hey John, sorry to be late in replying to this my friend, but I completely see where you’re coming from, and for some folks, LF is just too much, plain and simple.
Thanks for being 100% ‘you’ my friend.
Marcus
When i have comments on my blog, I really value them because they are my visitors too…
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Hi Marcus,
You know that I am new to all of this and I can say that it is surprising to read this. I never have heard of this platform and ok, intimidated by it for sure.
Question: would you use it on your swimming pool blog? or just on a blog about social media and blogging? Is your swimming pool blog more about content and less about comments? or both?
Thanks once again…
Karen Avery´s last [type] ..Top Three Scenic Drives in Ouray, Colorado for Passenger Vehicles
Great question Karen, so glad you asked. I would clearly not use it on my swimming pool blog. Many of those folks come in once for a specific question and then don’t come back. Others do. But I want to make that blog as least intimidating as possible to leave comments. But on a social media site, where everyone understands twitter, fb, and stuff like that, it certainly makes plenty of sense.
Thanks so much for asking Karen!!
Marcus
Dang Marcus, with 250+ comments on WP, your comments on Livefyre would be exponential!
I researched commenting systems extensively back in June. Really really preferred Livefyre over Disqus but thought that my readers would be discouraged from commenting if they had to sign up for anything and couldn’t just guest comment. Also really liked Brankica’s post several months back on how the backlinks add up with livefyre
I really don’t mind if it is inflated. It is becoming more and more popular and those on livefyre will then be equal!
Enjoy Cleveland!
Rajka
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Hey Rajka! So glad you liked this post and got a little something from it.
Yes, Cleveland went great and it was an amazing experience.
Thanks so very much for your kind words and support, and good luck with your commenting platform as your blog continues to grow!
Marcus
I personally think CommentLuv is artificially inflated, due to the fact so many bloggers comment on CommentLuv blogs to get their link on. But now LiveFyre has added a similar link posting method to their comment platform too, so maybe they are neck and neck now.
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For me, commentators are also important because they can increase traffic in our sites and we can meet new friends…
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The readers and every person that comments in a post plays a major role in the success of the blogger so we have to appreciate them…
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I had never even come across LiveFyre until I ended up here (or on the post that sent me here – I’ve lost my way!) and checked out some of the blogs of commenters above. I love to coment on blogs but I don’t like Disqus and typically won’t comment if I come across it. I don’t even understand it and don’t have time to figure it out. Regular old WP comment system is my favorite from either side of the fence.
Liz´s last [type] ..Earn Money with Dock Installation and Removal
I have heard of the Livefyre and I think I am not into it..I still prefer to use commentluv and it is more popular to people…
Sherrie´s last [type] ..How to Avoid Hip Replacement Infection
It seems like people are following. So it seems like inflation actually encourages participation.
D. Heath´s last [type] ..Choosing the Best Domain Name, Niche and Social Networks for Your Blog
I have tried Livefyre and I actually researched about it but it is not that catchy to people…Anyway, thanks for the additional information here…
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I’ve been relooking at comment systems lately. Your post and the comments were most helpful!
What I generally look for is ease of use, for both members and myself. It also has to look nice either by default or simple css changes.
I love the idea of LiveFyre social tagging and live updating. But I do worry about some of my readers who have slow internet connections. I would not want to loose them because the comment forums took to long to load.
Another thought is I have buddypress installed on my blog. If my members are already logged into my site and wish to comment on my blog, I don’t want them to have to join yet another site to do that. I would also want to make sure the comments are still fed into my bp stream. The @ tagging works for twitter and facebook but buddypress also uses @ tags. It would be great if that worked in Livefyre as well!
I was wondering what plugin are you using for the anti spam check box under the submit button? Do you find it works the same or better then captcha?
Thanks!
Not bad at all.. I agree
Actually I’ve found your website looking for reviews about livefyre as I was thinking about adding it to my small website. For what I’ve understood it’s a useful tool but I think you’ve also hit the main point about it risking to inflate comments. And I’ve also got to know about Triberr which is a new thing for me. To summarize great post, useful and a good reason to join your newslatter, which I’ve done.
Thanks and have a great day!
hypnodude´s last [type] ..Open the Third Eye and Be a Psychic Medium
So glad you found the post helpful…and good luck with your blog!!!
Marcus
Thanks Marcus, I’ve installed livefyre and it seems to work well, as I don’t have usually so many comments that they disappear in the mass. It might be that one day a big amount of comments becomes a problem but for now everything is fine.
The fact that you have so many good comments on your blog instead just reinforce the fact that you articles are worth reading, and also are very well written, so much that even someone like me whose first language is not English can understand everything.
Great blog, great posts, great comments, an example of a very good site.
Have a great day!
hypnodude´s last [type] ..How to Manifest with Intentions
I really appreciate that man. I try to communicate in a way that is direct, simple, and understandable by all. No one excuses me of being a genius, but I have been called a pretty good teacher more than once.
It took me 3 days to get through all the comments on this post! Who needs LF …
Actually, I just installed LiveFyre on my blog and I’m going to give it a good month as a test. I’m going to email my list this week and do a quick explanation as a way of encouraging them to log into LF.
I’ve use vanilla and disqus, and my comments have been growing for sure. My blogs in the fitness industry, and is basically a “how to”, so comments are generally questions. what I teach is rather technical, so I liked the potential of LF to foster a community atmosphere where everyone can help everyone else. We’ll see …
I’ll test it out, and let you know how it goes.
**btw, either it’s me or your commentluv isn’t working. So, here’s my link:
http://www.theironsamurai.com/2011/12/02/episode-8-how-to-snatch-part-2-the-romanian-snatch-deadlift/
Hahaha Nick, sorry about that.
I’m glad you’re testing it out, and yes, I’d love to know how it goes for you. Some folks adore it, others abhor it, it seems polarizing like that.
And thanks for the comment luv point, I’m not sure what’s up with that dang plugin these days, it’s giving me fits.
Marcus
OK … that experiment didn’t last as long as I’d expected!
I put LiveFyre on my site, was on for about a week, then a day ago I took it right back off again. Too many complaints by my readers (via email), a dramatic down-turn in comments, and a slight increase in page load time.
I’m sure that in the future, readers will be more hip to the extra login feature. But, as of now – apparently – my audience just wasn’t ready for it, and didn’t seem to give a hoot about the extra features like tagging, hooking in with FB and Twitter.
Back to plain ‘ole vanilla Wordpress native.
Nick
Nick Horton´s last [type] ..Part 2 – The Gay, The Straight, and The Funkadelic: Oscar Wilde on Weightlifting
Very interesting observation Nick! And I’m so glad you came back to share your experiences. Thank you!
I agree with your reservations with Live Fyre, I do however like the social aspect of it, and being able to tag people in your comment is something I think will catch on and perhaps be impletemented across other comment platforms. I haven’t actually seen it on many blogs yet but I have noticed it cropping up more and more just lately.
Hi Melanie! Yep, it has got some wonderful social features, and I wish you luck using the system!
Thanks for stopping by,
Marcus
Hey Marcus – I like to think of bizchickblogs as an early adopter of livefyre. We had it before a lot of the major blogs did, and I let it go at first because regular commenters HATED it.
Months later I installed it again because the spam – both human and computer generated – was driving me up a wall. For several months, Livefyre eliminated that problem.
Now, trackbacks are the major cause of my headache, and Livefyre just isn’t doing it for me anymore. Comments have stopped because I have stopped commenting on other blogs and my social media activity is almost non-existent (which makes sense). Traffic is still high, but conversation is for insiders, and I don’t have much anymore.
I’m re-launching bizchickblogs again in 2012 as something slightly different (a resource site with a blog, instead of just a blog), and I think I will say goodbye to Livefyre altogether. Because my blog isn’t like Gini’s where you have a lot of insider dialog, there’s just no need for something like that. A standard commenting system will do.
And I have also disabled trackbacks completely.
Thanks for your thoughts on Livefyre. Love the system for certain blogs and certain sites. It’s way cool. But not for every site.
Tia´s last [type] ..bizchickblogs – a time for rest
Hey Tia, great to see you! Yes, Livefyre is an interesting animal, and polarizing in many ways.
Either way, I hope you find what you’re looking for in 2012 and have great success!
Marcus
I am not so sure I agree about comment inflation. It is one thing to have a set of people increase the number of retweet but it is quite another to increase the comments. People still have to write the comment. Livefyre is pretty darn good at making this process easy – I was amazed at how easy it is to follow a conversation.
Interesting experiment. I am very interested in backlinking and curious about how Disqus or Livefyre contribute to that recognition by search engines. Any kind of commenting system has the potential to create human community, and I am registered on LiveFyre (but don’t use it much).
Astro Gremlin´s last [type] ..Alexa Review of Ana Hoffman’s Traffic Generation Cafe
I don’t think ‘more comments’ is necessarily a bad thing. But you’re always going to have an issue with bloat whenever you decide to allow user interaction – whether it’s letting them comment, make blogs, submit posts etc.
I’d rather have interaction with distraction than none at all
James´s last [type] ..Watch the Olympics on your iPhone
Oh, I agree James, some is better than none..no doubt. But as always, it does come back to goals too.
Thanks for dropping by,
Marcus
Marcus – I actually came here through Google search “i hate livefyre” (Dude, are you everywhere???)
Livefyre bothers me. It seems so demanding and as far as I can tell, you can’t even comment if you aren’t registered. And once you do, your inbox is slammed.
At least Disqus allows you to comment as guest.
It seems like bloggers are doing the bidding of a private company by employing Livefyre.
Please don’t switch!!! If you do, I’ll still read but you won’t have my awesome and insightful commentes.
John | Married (with Debt)´s last [type] ..The (Other) One Percent (Who WILL Hurt You)
Hahaha, all in the long tail my man.
As for Livefyre, I’m keeping my eye on them, and even since I wrote this article, their momentum has certainly slowed down a good bit out there…still a lot of kinks to work out.
Thanks bud,
Marcus
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I’ve only had a couple experiences with Livefyre and the one thing I remember about each is I did not leave a comment. For some reason I feel much more comfortable with Disqus, even use Disqus on a couple of my blogs. But I’m just as pleased with WP comments I especially love WP comments with CommentLuv and I like any comment system in which bloggers can use ReplyMe or some other plugin that allows bloggers to email me after I make a comment. Not sure what those other plugins would be, but I do enjoy the personal touch of a reply. As I read here from Benny, I think, Livefyre doesn’t allow plugins like that to be used.
Brian@pizza blog recipes´s last [type] ..Here’s a List of the Best Pizza in Every State
Good points Brian. For many, for whatever reason, LF doesn’t seem as “comfortable”. I don’t know why that is, but that’s the case.
Continued success to you and your blogs Brian!
Marcus
Good web…
wannak´s last [type] ..What is Cholesterol ?
I love the social aspects of LiveFyre, such as liking and inlinking which the default WordPress commenting system just doesn’t do.
I have heard a lot about LiveFyre recently so will be testing it on my blog to see how it compares as far as interaction goes.
It does seem to be good at attracting new commenters.
All legit points, and I’d be curious to see how it ends up for you…make sure to let us know Heather!
Marcus
Thank you for the great article !
At one of our stops, we asked a couple of our friends about the marriage license situation. “Didn’t you sign it when you got it at the courthouse?” one of the wise friends said
1. Aesthetics
This is fairly trivial to change using CSS.
2. Intimidation
Completely agree. It’s not the most friendly way to attract comments!
Some less technically astute may find it a little confusing… I did to start with :\
3. Smilies
I think it’s a fairly basic oversight by the LiveFyre team and I hope it will be implemented as soon as they get round to it.
4. Exportability.
A big thing for me is being able to export my data incase it all goes pear-shaped.
At the moment LiveFyre doesn’t seem to have the export/import options I would like so haven’t made the switch yet
Accendo Markets´s last [type] ..Another Level -13 Mar (ADM, AMEC, BLT , EVR)
Great additions to the conversation, appreciate it!
Good think for good people think positive and work positive and learn the best blog and blogs comments.
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I guess you are quite right, i am also shifting back from disquss comments to normal comments.
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If you want the most powerful popularity for you and your blog. Blog comment is the best solutions for you. I must say your blog is very nice
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I am intrigued by livefyre. I think it caters to the youngest generation that accustomed to getting everything quickly and being across multiply platforms at the same time. I think it definitely take something away from traditional commenting and perhaps discourages people from sitting back and conjuring well thought out, insightful comments. It just renders commenting into the same realm as live chatting, which tend to be a lot chirpier and less thoughtful.
FYI: “Livefyre it Too Good” TYPO???
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I tend to agree with you. I like the old style, however I have switched “jumped on the band wagon” myself and installed LF. Not too bad. I don’t have a lot of traffic on a lot of my sites yet however it’s cut down on spam quite a bit. Great article.
Glad you liked it Brandon, good luck to you and your blog!
Marcus
3 Comments into livefyre and already silent banned.
Yeah… I think perhaps it is destroying the value of a blog comment.
Blog commenting is solutions for your popularity .I think if we think ,work , positive and study good it is best for good blog commenting.
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Good point about the comment inflation. As a commenter, I think I prefer Livefyre’s though.
There are so many different aspects when it comes to this topic.Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge on this particular aspect.
I think Livefyre is a great comment system, but that does not mean commentluv is not a good system. I placed it on my blog because I want more participation on my blog.
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Sounds great Michael, hope it goes well for you bud.
Marcus
As a commenter I think Livefyre has a good interface and look.
Livefyre also looks good to me since I saw my comments almost instantly there.But yes these systems are often attacked by spammers.
well, there are 300 and more comments here, I dont have time to read of of them,,, jeje, anyway I believe i am going for livefyre for now
Ikiam´s last [type] ..CONFIRMADO, Matanza Taurina en la Feria Jesús del Gran Poder 2012 en Quito CANCELADA, pero la lucha debe continuar
I agree with you about the aesthetics and the confusion — and the inability to manage the stream coherently somewhere else *intuitively* than in your email box if you are an ordinary user.
But worst of all, Livefyre doesn’t play nice with certain platforms who use certain content-management systems that they don’t interact with — sending many follow-up comments into the oblivion of 404s. And I think that’s deliberate, and that some content sites like Foreign Policy are happy to allow that to happen, because it’s a rough-and-ready way of decreasing the volume of comments, which can be huge.
http://3dblogger.typepad.com/wired_state/2013/01/livefyresucks.html
The comments on this page, was at least, what I expected frm livefyre, but they are not.
The problem? Simple. Those guys think as programmers. Tend to complicate things and hide others, and are so closed, that up to this time, had done nothing about it, but still programming hard more complicated things like programmers do.
They see far away, but not what is in front of them. Users.
We are not the users of the future, we are users now.
Don’t even have a lang. spanish when there are millions of possible users.
Why? hard to code? o to translate? of course not.
There are other options better, disqus, intense debate, with problems too, but they have more than we need.
Time to remove that thing from my site.
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