A Review of Mautic Marketing Automation for WordPress: One Last Tool Episode 7
Announcer: Is your digital business efforts in need of a tune-up or major overhaul? If you’re ready to get your sales, marketing and service machine up and running, you’re going to need just the right tools. Welcome to One Last Tool, your pit stop for learning about all of the latest and greatest digital tools to get your business engine running on all cylinders. And now, here’s your resident technician, George B. Thomas.
George: All right, ladies and gentlemen, George B. Thomas here for another episode of One Last Tool. And today I know I always say I’m excited, but today, holy mackerel. Can anybody say #GameChanger? That’s what we’re going to talk about today. But as always, this episode of One Last Tool is brought to you by WPInboundMachine.com. Look, if you’re trying to build an inbound marketing machine and have zero budget, then check out WPInboundMachine.com today.
All right. So, without further ado, because I want to dive into the good stuff, no fluff, just good, good stuff, why don’t we go ahead and meet David Hurley. David, why don’t you explain to the viewers and listeners because they could be on iTunes, they could be on YouTube, they could be on our website — we’re just reporting to the entire world about this goodness that is Mautic. Why don’t you explain who you are, what you do and who you do it for?
David: Sure. First of all, it’s a pleasure to be here. I’m really glad to have an opportunity to talk to you. I’ve heard about your recent successes at the conference you were at, so pretty awesome. I’m talking to the celebrity here. So, yeah, again, my name is David and I’m the lucky founder of a startup called Mautic. We are revolutionizing marketing technology, particularly marketing automation, which is a whole branch of software.
We’re doing it with an open source solution. So, similar to what you might find in that CMS space with WordPress or Drupal or Joomla, we’re accomplishing the same things in marketing software. So, it’s really exciting and it’s a powerful tool that is available to millions of people and we’re just watching it grow right now and seeing how this community adopts it and really starts to use it.
George: Yeah. And David, first of all, I’m going to try not to geek out on this interview. Just for the listeners, this is probably going to be the most intense like, “George, mind yourself,” interview. Let’s start really at the beginning with this. What is Mautic? Almost with that, because I have had an opportunity . . . listeners, just so you know, I have actually dove into Mautic. I’m using it on two personal websites because I really want to know what is this next thing that’s, again, game changer.
What is Mautic and almost with that, explain marketing automation a little bit for those people who might be listening to this and are like, “I don’t really know what you mean because I’m not a HubSpot user. I’m not a Marketo user.” Kind of give us the baseline of this stuff.
What Is Mautic?
David: Yeah. Absolutely. For anybody that’s in that position, it’s really not that uncommon at all because traditionally, this software has been so ridiculously overpriced that people couldn’t afford it. Therefore, they never understood it or knew what it was about. If you’re in that group, you’re in a big group and that’s not a bad position to be in.
So real high level, marketing automation, the whole idea is that you are able to reach your contacts, your users, the site visitors that come to your website with targeted messaging in a timely manner in a channel that meets where they’re at. That last piece is a little bit where we become more unique than everyone else. Traditionally, people think of marketing automation as basically equal to email marketing.
If you think about it at the very lowest level, it’s sending emails over a time period to a user. That’s the extent of what many will look at marketing automation as. In truth, the real substance in marketing automation is that you would put a little tracking pixel, similar to like Google Analytics would do. And what it does is it allows you to track every visitor to your website but not at the Google Analytics reporting, where it’s just this generic bundle of people that have visited your site or visited this page, but extremely individualized and personalized.
You track every single person. And then when they fill out a form on your site, whether that’s a contact form or any other type of form where they give you some identifying information, you now have an entire history for that person and what they’ve done on your site, how long they’ve been on a page, what they’re interested in.
As a result of that, you can begin to build a campaign for how you will reach out to them. Send them an email. Based on their response, if they open the email, you might send them another email a couple days later or maybe that’s something that’s more valuable to you and you might follow up with a text message.
That’s where we get into something others don’t do. We actually say it should be every channel, not just email. It should be any channel the user is on. That’s at the very highest level. The whole idea would be you’re nurturing those site visitors or those leads along a little bit of an introductory process and eventually they would work into the CRM system.
In fact, in smaller business where they don’t have a CRM in place even, many are actually using Mautic just as a CRM and you move them to a specific lead list and at that point, your sales people say anything on that list we’re going to call personally because at that point, you know they’ve gone through this campaign cycle, they’re ready to buy or they’re ready to listen to what you have to offer to them.
George: Yeah. Listeners, I hope you know by just the beginning of that one question that first of all, if you are that person that is not in the marketing automation space, I know your mind is like blown and you’re like, “Wait, wait, stop, I’m taking notes. I’m taking notes.” And that’s fine.
But you just heard list segmentation, lead nurturing. You heard lead intelligence. And one of the things I’m even going nerdier than that, when I opened up Mautic and saw that in a campaign I could actually tweet out automatically to a handle, I was like, “What? Like what is happening right now?” I felt like the time continuum was stretching in that moment.
Let’s take this a couple steps back because we kind of know what Mautic is. It’s a software that allows you to do all these awesome things. It really is kind of an all in one tool for what you need to run a digital business at this point. Maybe David . . . oh, by the way, I should mention David, you’ve got that down pat, dude. That was like . .
David: A good answer?
George: I was like, “Come on.”
David: I work on that one because it’s a hard one. Marketing automation is a difficult topic and it really does make people’s eyes glaze over. I want to try to give it a real high level. It’s really easy. It’s simple to use once you understand the tool. That’s what we’re trying to do with this whole product is make it so people can under it and use it.
George: Love it. So let’s go with the second question here that we have. Really, how does Mautic work? Like for the end user, like how does it work?
How Does Mautic Work?
David: Yeah. So you have two different end users. It’s the people that would visit the website, then you’ve got the site owners and the business that would be using Mautic in its place. So, for the end user perspective, their experience on page is actually going to be far improved because this is where another channel comes into play, dynamic web content. It allows you to actually customize the page content to that particular visitor.
Now, I totally get that can be a creepy factor if you do it wrong. So, we have to always caution people to do that in the right way. You don’t want to call out, “Hey, George. How are you doing today? How are the cats?” That’s a little bit weird. But if you can do that in a way that offers them useful information, it improves that user experience tremendously.
So, for the end user, it becomes a better, cleaner web experience all the way around, even down to the forms where you have progressive form fields. So, if you filled out that form before, you might not see the same fields on that form. So, you don’t have to feel like you’re repeating redundantly information you’ve entered in. All and all, it’s a better experience for the end user. For the business, once you’ve set it up, it practically runs itself.
That’s where it becomes such a powerful tool. Instead of you as a business owner spinning your wheels trying to contact every random person that filled out your contact form never knowing their level of engagement, you can use Mautic to begin to nurture those people along an automated process that’s still highly personalized and then reach out to them at the time that fits your schedule and when you know they’re actually more interested in what you have.
George: Yeah. And so I’m going to go off script here for a second, David, because most people that listen to this probably know me from another podcast called the Hubcast. They also know that I am in the space of like ultra HubSpot user, like eight certifications, nine certifications, HubSpot accredited trainer. Folks, what David just told you about was smart content, being able to change the content based on user.
It’s actually been a HubSpot wish list item for me for about two years that I would be able to do that on a site like WordPress. I about fainted when I saw what you could do it inside of Mautic, for free, might I add, and then of course I didn’t faint and I immediately started working on how am I going to add this content to my website and how does that change my WordPress strategy just from the get? I can do this way differently. I can do this way better.
The other thing I would like you to hit on though because when I asked the question how does Mautic work, maybe you can explain too for the folks that there are actually two different ways you can use this on your site. There’s a cloud version and then there’s actually an install it on your server. Because I’m #nerdy, that’s what I did. You can install it on your server of you can use a cloud version and maybe explain the two differences of those.
David: Absolutely. I’m really glad you actually mentioned that because it’s one of the distinguishing factors about Mautic. We believe in empowering people. We don’t believe the software is what you should be charging for. That software, that powerful tool that allows you to do your business better, that should just be available to you. You should just have that available.
As a result of that, as that being one of our motivating factors, we give the software away for free. We do that in two different ways, one is as a download. That gives you free and clear access to the entire source code. Everything that ever is written that’s available for you to see to make modifications to. So, for the geeks in the room, you can tear it apart, you can make it do exactly what you want it to do. It’s under a GPL type of license but now we’re getting real geek.
Bottom line is if you’re familiar with a server architecture setup or if you’ve installed a WordPress site, it’s actually just as simple to install Mautic as it is to install WordPress. It’s a click through type of user interface, so it’s super easy But we also recognize there are a lot of users that don’t really have that level of tech or are not interested in the headaches associated with the possibility of setting all that up. We offer a cloud version as well.
What we did with the cloud version is obviously we have costs associated with that, but at the same time we’re driven by this idea of empowering people. So the lowest tier that we have in the cloud is actually a free tier. We give 5,000 records in that free tier. That’s unlimited at 5,000.
When you look at others in the space — I’m not going to call anybody out by name but I certainly don’t want to hurt any feelings of people who are geeks in the room that are big on this. The level is a magnitude larger of free users that you have access to be able to contact, not just through email, but through all those channels and all those different ways.
We wanted to give it in two different flavors, really. For those that are hardcore and want to do it on their own server, it’s completely unlimited — one million, two million, five million. We actually know one . . . great story, I’m off topic now myself but I had a great story with somebody that’s out of Chicago.
They wanted to call in to thank us for the software they were using because it was free and wasn’t costing them a penny. They were saying, “We actually have multi servers set up round robin with a single Mautic instance sending out a couple million emails per day for free as a result of Mautic.” That is awesome. That’s the type of story we love to hear because that’s what we’re all about. It shouldn’t be the software. It’s all the other potential ways in which it’s done.
George: Yeah. And it’s funny because one of the questions I ask — and that was a great story — one of the questions I ask is about cost. When we started the conversation with free, that kind of blows that question, but not really. I actually knew that we’d hit that. I kind of reframe it a little bit and I’ll ask that in a little bit. Let’s talk about who is a best fit for Mautic.
One of the best things about business is knowing who we’re not a good fit for and who we are a good fit for. While some people might have the budget and have purchased something like Marketo or HubSpot, Eloqua, Infusionsoft, I can go on and on and on. I’m not saying they’re a bad fit. They just didn’t know the option was out there. So I’m going to just shut up, let you answer the question who do you feel that Mautic really is a good fit for?
Who Is A Great Fit For Mautic?
David: It’s a fair question. It’s one actually that we looked at long and hard as we created this software platform, the idea of best fit for Mautic. It ended up being a case where because it’s an open source free product, that really targets anyone at any level of revenue generation. They could be the smallest mom and pop shop ever, but if they have a server with WordPress on it and they want to start marketing automation, they can do it and it doesn’t cost them anything at all.
It really scales everything down to that lowest level. Even for people that are like, “I know MailChimp. I know how to send emails. You can do that same exact structure within Mautic and save yourself $9 a month. As little as that is, it’s important. We think it scales all the way down there and it works really well at that level.
At the same time, we underestimated, I underestimated when I started the severity of the pain with existing tools like the Marketo, the Eloqua, the Pardots. Like you, I can go on and on and on. Every time I talked with somebody, story after story from massive enterprises, global, Fortune 500, the immense struggle they had with the software solutions, they were looking for something better. When they found Mautic, as they find Mautic, they recognize that there’s power there.
So, of course, we have tailored solutions that meet those needs at that massive scale level. We do generate revenue and that’s one of the ways in which we generate revenue. The software itself is always free, but what it does is the software itself can scale quite well because of the community that puts code into it, because it’s developed by tens of thousands of volunteers all over the world, what it does — I promise not to get into that; maybe it will come up later — but it allows us to innovate at an incredibly fast pace.
The dynamic web content that we talked about a minute ago, that was released in a single six-week period from start inception, “We need to do it,” to push out there, live code available to everyone, six weeks’ timeframe. That’s the speed in which we can continue to innovate this software.
So what it means is as new software becomes available, we can continue to grow at that same innovative and robust level and it meets the needs of those large, large enterprises that are handling multi-millions of records. We had one customer recently that said we’re all tracking about 100 million contacts. Is that going to be a problem? We can handle that. So, the system really scales quite well.
George: Super amazing. There’s so much going through my head right now. When we talked about . . . people are like, “Wow, I’ve never really seen George geek out like this,” but when we talked about being able to use Mautic for your emails and not using the MailChimp, the first time I sent an email through the Mautic system, I was like, “Oh my gosh, that was like super simple.” It just worked, right? I attached some things and typed some copy and I went out and I was like, “Wow, this is amazing.”
The other thing is really the answer to that is we’re a good fit or Mautic is a good fit for almost anybody because it just scales. It just makes sense and it just works and you can modify it to what you need.
The other thing you said in there that I’m really nerding out is that Mautic is literally the story of the digital David, meaning the fact that there are so many people that are invested in this that you can take . . . let’s say for instance I was on this podcast and said, “It would be great if we had a call to actions tool inside HubSpot where we can do trackable links and buttons and yadda, yadda, yadda,” that could go out to the community and within a week, two weeks, six weeks, that feature might actually be in the software and now we’ve got another piece we didn’t have before.
I’m going to tell you, large companies, because of being large companies really can’t do that anymore. So I’m going to stop geeking out.
David: Really quick, can I tell one story on that very line?
George: Yeah. Go ahead.
David: Can I tell one story on that very line?
George: Yeah. Go ahead.
David: I was just over in Japan. We had some incredible meetups in Japan and I was over there talking to them. As I was working with them, one of the tools they found really valuable to them was a tool called Line, which is similar to WhatsApp. It’s an instant messaging type kind of channel passage, but unlike WhatsApp, it has a really good API structure, which means you can push messaging to that from a computer instead of just phone to phone.
So they said, “Do you have an integration for Mautic with that?” I said, “No. But we’d love to have one. I think it would be really valuable.” The next day I had an engineer walk up to me and say, “I wrote a Line integration for Mautic and it’s available and we can give it out to everybody.”
Just like that in a single 24-hour period because of the power of the community and the open source nature of the code, we had somebody from the community who stepped up, wrote an integration, and now you can push to Line through Mautic as part of your campaign structure. So exactly what you’re talking about, it’s just phenomenal to witness it firsthand.
George: Folks, you heard it here. It’s absolutely mind-blowing. And this is taking a step back. Again, for those people who maybe aren’t doing this marketing automation thing, haven’t been in anything before, what problem or problems because it really is problems, maybe you can pick like one or two you really want to address, what problem or problems does Mautic really handle for you as a digital business person in 2016-2017 moving forward?
What Problems Does Mautic Solve For Your Business?
David: I think one of the major struggles that businesses face is knowing how to talk to their users because people are inundated with messages across all sorts of different places, whether that’s social media, whether that’s email or mobile, text or push notifications or even on your desktop in like a browser notification.
There are so many ways to communicate to people and so many ways for them to communicate to you that you become lost. It becomes very hard as a business to connect with your people. So what we’re trying to do is create this platform in a way that allows you to reach them with the right message where they’re going to be at and to be able to listen to them as well, really making it a personalized marketing.
It takes it one step further from that segmented marketing, where you just send it to a list of people and – boom – everybody gets that email because they’re in that list. Instead what it does is George gets this email because of this, David gets this text message because of that and it makes it completely and totally personalized while still automating it because it has to save you time as a business owner.
George: That’s ridiculous. That’s like a peanut butter and jelly sandwich of choose your own adventure marketing automation all mixed in one. So this is usually where I ask the folks the question that makes them kind of skirt around in their seat a little bit and I go, “Hey, how much does Mautic cost?”
And in your case, I know the answer is free, but I know there’s going to be — of course you don’t have to explain everything, but at least some things — the question might be, “Well, okay, how does Mautic stay alive? How does it generate revenue? Where is the model in being a free piece of software?” Maybe kind of address that a little bit for the listeners.
How Does Mautic Monetize?
David: That’s always . . . first of all it’s a touchy question that people always are nervous to ask and I love it. I’m like bring it every time. I’m like we’re doing something amazing and it’s hard for people to get their heads wrapped around it because it is free software. I always love to point to example with Red Hat. They made a $10 billion revenue business off of free software. And actually Red Hat, one of their former CEOs is a personal mentor of mine. I meet with him every couple of weeks.
What we’re doing is actually completely different in one sense and very much the same in another because we’re in a different digital age. We’re in the age of the cloud. We’re in the age of everything being in a digital online type of world as opposed to a boxed software type of world. But some of the challenges are still the same and some of the ways in which we can generate revenue are also.
So what we’re doing to generate revenue is actually surrounded around the product itself. The software is free, but if you’re on the cloud version, you have to have integrations to the different tools that will send your text messages or send your emails. Rather than you having to sustain those costs, we’re taking those on and then just passing it all to you as one deal.
So it simplifies it from a headache perspective. You don’t have to worry about any of that. It’s already covered for you. Now, if you’re in a download version, that’s completely all on you. You can setup your email. You can setup your texts. You can setup your different channel notifications and you never pay a penny. We will generate absolutely zero revenue off of you at any point in your life. We just want to empower you. So, we built it off of the cloud version.
We also offer additional features and software that’s available at the enterprise level or at the agency level because we believe those two markets are severely underserved. Without crippling everyone, we believe market automation software should be free. What we’re doing is working on a different layer. We’re working on a level above that and that level services the needs of enterprise, higher mid-markets and then the agency space.
George: So it sounds to me — we’re going to go off the beaten path for a second — it sounds to me that you just explained maybe a different tool that it leads into for agencies and enterprise. Would you say that?
David: That’s a fair assumption. In fact, you’ll see some hints of it on our website even now with Mautic.com. You’ll it’s a tool called Maestro. We believe that the future is in marketing intelligence. We’re doing something revolutionary there. I’m not going to go into the details just yet, but . . .
George: Well, when you’re ready.
David: It’s amazing what we’re doing right now.
George: When you’re ready, it’s definitely another One Last Tool interview, for sure.
David: That sounds perfect.
George: I love this part. This part to me I can’t wait to ask this question. So, who are Mautic’s competitors?
Who Are Mautic’s Competitors?
David: So we consider . . . I’d love to say that we have no competition because if you look at the software comparison, but I recognize that’s not the answer people want. In truth, we believe we are changing marketing automation at the enterprise level. If you look at that space today, you’ll find Marketo, Eloqua and Pardot as the big three in the space. We believe that what they’re doing is a bit archaic, a bit broken and we believe we can do it better.
George: Yeah. So I would also add in another person in there which would HubSpot, right? If you looked at small to medium sized businesses — we talked about Mautic being scalable — you’re totally in that line.
George: This is the part I also love to ask because you get to talk about yourself because I make you talk about yourself. The question is what makes Mautic . . . I know the default would be like, “We’re free.” Go past that. What makes Mautic better than the competition?
How Is Mautic Better Than It’s Competitors?
David: Yeah. I would love to go past that. I never want to value what we’re doing on a price basis only. In fact, if somebody asks me what a differentiating factor is, I would probably never even refer to it as free. If they don’t know it’s free, that may never even come up in conversation. We differentiate based on the abilities of the software.
What we do is say you know what? It’s not one channel. It’s not a poor UI. It’s not a slow interface. It’s not a crippled integration set. So, what we believe is that it should be multi-channel, omnichannel, whatever the magic word you want to use for that is. It should be available to everybody. It should be on a platform that is fully integratable with other tools. At the same time, we don’t think we have to be the one tool that does it all.
There could be a perfectly great like WordPress, for example, that’s a perfect integration opportunity. We’re not going to be your blog. You should have your blog instead. Just integrate the forms from Mautic directly in your blog page. So, now your blog page, that’s your landing page on property, your user stays within the same seamless experience and your data gets put directly into Mautic. That’s an integration example. We believe those integrations are incredibly powerful and we believe the tool should be customizable and move fast.
George: Amen to that move fast part. I will tell you too, like the landing page tool inside of Mautic, it’s pretty sick as well.
George: That’s the thing. There are just some pieces that work really well and they make sense to be there and you want to be able to measure on some of this stuff, so we didn’t even talk about the fact of reporting and all that stuff inside of Mautic as well. But as I’ve kind of bumped around on the Internet, David, I’ve realized there are two different kinds of people. There are those tech savvy people and then there’s the people that just aren’t. So, what are the possible problems that users might run into when they start to use Mautic?
What Problems Might Users Face When Using Mautic?
David: Yeah. That’s a fair question. I think you’ll experience that any time there’s new software that people aren’t familiar with. There are going to be problems that come up. Really what we find is usually there’s a lot of understanding that has to occur. There’s a bit of a learning curve about it just in general, “How do I use this effectively? Where do I go to get help? What are the best practices for getting started?”
We see those as the key problem areas that we want to be able to specifically address. The community is one win, which we addressed that. Because of the size of the global community, we have language translations galore. That means people can find the help they need in their local dialect.
We also have a really active community both in forums as well as on Slack, which is like an online instant messaging tool where people are always talking. I still remember that moment — it was several months ago now — it was that moment when I realized there were more conversations happening on there than I could personally pay attention to. And they were happening 24 hours a day.
For me it was like at this point I either have to choose not to listen or not sleep ever again. That’s when I saw this snowball effect in the community. Now people could find help from others in the community any time day or night. That’s 24-hour support for free from a community that understands what they’re doing. That’s a huge area where people can find solutions for common problems as well as understanding that basic setup is an experience. People have to learn to grow into knowing how to use it effectively.
So we’re kind of combating that with . . . we have a director of training. He’s phenomenal. His name is Rod. He’s been putting tons of videos together working on training courses. Our YouTube has a lot of different videos where people can actually learn about, see it first hand and do that either through a Mautic minute, which is like 60-second go through feature really fast or some more in depth-type types of pieces as well.
George: Yeah. I love hearing that you guys are focused on education. I’ll be honest with you, I just did – and we talked about this at the beginning – I just did a talk at Inbound ’16, which is I’m just dating it because you might be watching this a year or two years later. We talked about how one of the major differentiating factors of HubSpot and the rest of the platforms out there is that they have a kick butt — and I’m only going to use that word because it’s PG — a kick butt academy or educational system that you can actually get certifications for this, that and the other thing.
I think Mautic, as it grows and fleshes out and you have these videos and these documents and eventually who knows, maybe someday there are like Mautic certifications and what not — I won’t take that smile as a, “Yeah, we’ve thought about that,” that just thickens or adds to the pot or whatever like great thing I’m trying to say there.
So, I think it’s awesome. I think you guys are doing really well. This is usually where I end the interview. These are my questions. What I want to do is because I want to kind of just give you the floor for a couple seconds, a couple minutes, whatever you want and if there’s anything that you think the listeners should know or that you just want to kind of give them as an inspirational piece or whatever, kind of give us your, “Hey, guys, this is what you should be doing. This is what you could be doing.”
Words Of Wisdom From David Hurley.
David: Yeah. Sure. I appreciate that, really, honestly, having a little bit of bonus time at the end because we are different. We are doing things differently. That’s really the takeaway I want to give here at the very end is yeah, the software is amazing. It can stand its own against any of those major players. It can work and scale at any level.
But really what we’re about is empowering people through a community. It’s more than just taking something and using it for yourself, but it becomes where you have the opportunity to be involved in something yourself and something that’s greater than you can ever do alone. That’s where it becomes so powerful.
When we have people in meetups happening around the globe every single month gathering to talk about Mautic, how it has changed their business or even ultimately their lives and then they want to put that time back into Mautic to help others, that’s what causes this thing to snowball.
Really, what I encourage people to do is to definitely use this software, get involve with it, discover all the features and power that it can do for you to change your business and then think about how can I be a part of this? It doesn’t have to be just tech. People think, “Well, it’s open source software so I can’t write code. I can’t help.”
There are a million and one ways to get involved, whether that is writing a blog article or bragging about it on a podcast or doing a magazine, anything that you have an opportunity to actually get involved with and help the overall movement, you’re able to do that. That’s where it gets personally rewarding, personally satisfying. You realize there’s more to this life than just finding another piece of free software and using it for myself. How can I actually give back?
So, we’re really big on that. We’re also big on efficiency because we believe your time is incredibly valuable. So, I guess as an ending note from me, I really appreciate the time that everyone has shared, taken and given to me and this opportunity to talk to you. We believe that the software, it should be fast and intuitive so you can use your time effectively.
As a marketer, you can spend your time doing the things you want to do. That might not even be in marketing software. Maybe that is helping you out at a local charity. Maybe that’s donating your time somewhere else. Your time is incredibly valuable. That’s really the takeaway here. That’s what a community is about at the end of the day.
George: Man, David, I love it. I appreciate you taking the time to actually do the interview with us. I want to leave with one last question and that is if people want to connect with you, if they want to learn more about Mautic, where do you want to send them? What do you want them to do?
Where Can You Learn More About Mautic?
David: Yeah. If you’re looking to get involved in Mautic from a community standpoint, Mautic.org is a great way to get in touch with the community. If you’re interested in learning more just about the software in general from a marketing or business perspective, then Mautic.com is the place where you can find all that type of relevant information. And honestly once you start to get in and once you start to recognize and talk to people, I think you’ll be changed. I think you’ll be excited about it and I would love to see people show up there.
George: Definitely. Well, folks, that’s how we roll here on One Last Tool. No fluff, just great tools. If you are listening via iTunes, make sure you go ahead and leave us a raving review. You can leave us any review you want, but we like the good ones as well. Until next time folks, go out there and just use One Last Tool.
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